Veterans Archives: Preserving the Stories of our Nations Heroes
In a world where storytelling has been our link to the past since the days of cave drawings, there exists a timeless tradition. It's the art of passing down knowledge, and for Military Veterans, it's a crucial piece of their legacy. Join us on the Veterans Archives Podcast, where we dive deep into the heartwarming and awe-inspiring stories of those who served, no matter when or where.
Here, Veterans get the chance to be the authors of their own narratives. Through guided interviews in a relaxed and safe environment, they paint their experiences with their own words and unique voices. The result? A memory card in a presentation box, a precious gift they can share however they please.
But that's not all. These stories find a secure home in our archive, a treasure chest of experiences for future generations to explore. The best part? It's all a gift to the Veteran – our way of saying thank you for their service.
Tune in to the Veterans Archives Podcast, where history, heroism, and heartwarming tales come to life.
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Veterans Archives: Preserving the Stories of our Nations Heroes
Family, Food, and Freedom: A Greek Immigrant's Journey (Art Arvanites)
Art Arvanites's story begins in the shadow of World War II, where as a young boy in a small Greek village, he witnessed German occupation forces take his father, leaving his mother to raise five children alone. Barefoot and without basic school supplies, Art's resourcefulness emerged early as he moved between relatives and developed street-smart ways to survive. His poignant memory of asking his mother for a pencil for school—only to be told she couldn't afford one—underscores the poverty that shaped his early years.
The narrative transforms when, at nearly 17, Art receives sponsorship to immigrate to America. Arriving at Ellis Island after a 17-day ocean voyage with just $4 in his pocket, he experiences both culture shock and opportunity. His description of his first American meal—a ham and cheese sandwich that tasted "rotten" compared to familiar Greek food—captures the profound adjustment immigrants face.
Art's journey accelerates through military service, where he gains citizenship and English skills serving as a clerk typist in the U.S. Army. Returning to Lansing, his business acumen flourishes as he purchases Harry's Place restaurant across from the Fisher Body plant—a strategic decision that becomes the foundation of his success. His entrepreneurial ventures expand dramatically into real estate development, where his knack for identifying opportunity leads to remarkable investment returns.
Throughout his story, family values remain central. Art's pride in his four children, his partnership with his wife Theoria, and his commitment to helping relatives shine through every anecdote. Now at 90, still maintaining his own property and reflecting on his journey with profound gratitude, Art offers timeless wisdom: "Work hard, be happy, and enjoy life. Be honest to your fellow citizens, don't harm anybody."
This remarkable immigrant story demonstrates how resilience, work ethic, and entrepreneurial spirit can transform adversity into achievement. What challenges have you overcome in your own journey? Share your story of persistence and join our community of listeners exploring the extraordinary lives of ordinary people.
Today is Monday, July 14th 2025. We're talking with Art Arvanitis, who served in the United States Army, so good afternoon, Art.
Speaker 2:Good afternoon Bill.
Speaker 1:Great to see you today. Now full disclosure. Art is my uncle or my Theo Art, so I'm interested to learn all about you, and the way we're going to start is I'm going to ask you quite simply when and where were you born?
Speaker 2:when and where were you born? I was born June 20th 1935 in Malota.
Speaker 1:Greece, which is a village near Megalopoli, Arcadia, greece. Okay, so you just had a 90th birthday recently, then how does it feel to be 90?
Speaker 2:Well, no difference than 80 or 70. A little bit slower.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, I can understand that. Well, let's talk a little bit about growing up. So you grew up in Greece. What was it like to be a young man in Greece?
Speaker 2:Well, I tell you, there was a rough time during the Second World War, which the Germans well, first the Italians and then the Germans came into Greece and they came in with, were in southern Greece, and there was devastating times.
Speaker 1:My I don't want to talk about that. Okay, we don't have to. Theodore, so how old were you when you came to the United States?
Speaker 2:I was pretty near 17.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right.
Speaker 2:But anyway, what I want to say before, All right, but anyway what I want to say before. When the Germans came to our village, which is only about 37 homes or something, and they took my dad, so my mother was left with five kids. The oldest was nine, my sister and I had a younger sister which was about three, and I was the fourth child born. So it was very, very tough times I don't even want to talk about that Okay, all right.
Speaker 1:We can take our time.
Speaker 2:Anyway.
Speaker 1:So that left your mother to raise all the children.
Speaker 2:Yes, and my grandma had a brother at the other village, which is Kedastari, and her brother was a priest, papupapavageli, and he came to the village to see my mother and us and asked my oldest brother want to go with him to Kerastari and stay? And he said no. He asked my other brother. He asked my other brother, elia. He says, would you like to come to Calistari and stay with me? No, and then he asked me and I said sure, I was the adventurous, it sounds like it. And Papua, papua, there was nobody living in his village at that time. So he wanted some company because he had two sons and a daughter. His son was killed during the. He was a pilot, he got killed during when the Italians were coming into northern Greece, and the other was drafted in the army. And the third was a daughter, dina. Yeah, I remember George Tasso and Dina. So Papua Vigali took me to Kerastari and I think it must have been either 42 somewhere, fall of 42, and I stayed in Kerastari till 1948.
Speaker 1:So from about seven years old to about 13 years old, then you were there. Did you visit home at all during that time?
Speaker 2:Yes, you know I. I had gone many times to visit mom and my other siblings, but that was a hard time because we had no shoes.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 2:Yeah, going barefooted. You know I must have been in the first grade or something that they had. The school was. I had one room that a visiting teacher was coming and you know the other kids, they were writing with a pencil. And I went home and I asked my mom and I said, mom, they're writing something with the pencil. Can I have a pencil myself? And that's what I get emotional, mm-hmm she. She said I don't have anything to buy it.
Speaker 1:So that's, why.
Speaker 2:It's very difficult. Yeah, you know, we're fortunate in this country.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry, Bill. You're fine, Theo, You're fine Art. We take a lot for granted, I think. We do. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I hope this country never takes anything for granted, because we really love this country the freedom that we have. We really love this country.
Speaker 1:The freedom that we have. So how long so did you graduate from school then in Greece? How long did you stay in school?
Speaker 2:Well, no, I didn't. Okay. I left Kyrhtari in 1948 and I was in Tripoli, which you probably heard Tripoli, it's on the center of Peloponnese, you know that and I was selling watermelons for an uncle and I made enough money from the watermelons to go to Athens where one of my dad's youngest brother was living, and I was fortunate enough, it was the Irene and the Ocosta. They were terrific, very, very good. Just like the parents that I did not have, so….
Speaker 1:So I want to ask you were doing… you traveled on your own. Then you went to different family members, but you traveled on your own at that young age.
Speaker 2:I remember going from village to village and there's white clay and you know because during the summertime, when you travel like that and you're going barefoot and you see and there's snakes, you know they and and you're chasing them and you look at anyway. But yeah. I had to travel. You know, Papu Papa was, I think, probably in his middle 70s that time. Yeah.
Speaker 2:So, and then he had his own problems with some of the villagers that they left to join the different parties and they were threatening him and I think in 1946 he left. He went to Athens during the night From 1946 to 48, I was staying in Karastari by myself.
Speaker 1:Oh, so yeah. So then you went to, then you sold watermelons and then you ended up in Athens.
Speaker 2:Yes, and then when I went to Athens in September I'm pretty sure that was because I went to register at the second gymnasium in Greece, in Athens, and I remember that principal, or whoever it was he says to me write an essay how you left the village to be here and so forth. And I wrote a couple pages and he didn't even look at them. He says I'm sorry, we're all full. And I went to talk to what I call Theo Costa and I said that's what happened. And I think he kind of looked confused and I don't know if he talked to them or what, but Theokos had no means to and I think that if he was a principal he expected to get paid under the table to register me to go to school there, Right?
Speaker 2:So Theo Costa says well, you stay with me and we'll do some. I used to go to nightclubs and sell any kind of pumpkin seeds and I used to go to different seasons, go to the games where they were playing soccer, and I used to sell. At the beginning I used to sell. At the beginning. I used to buy a big chocolate they used to call it Hermes. It was huge and I used to make a little lottery and say to them you know, ticket for this, you know for so many drag masters, and it was sold out and we're moving over and calling the number in that area and nobody was there. So we I had a little a neighborhood kid with me and we were setting up and eating all the whole chocolate and watching the game. So next time I bought three, uh-huh, so I got to and I used to give two out and keep the rest one and and.
Speaker 2:Later on, when I got some money in my pocket, I used to buy the tickets in the Greek system. That time If you buy the tickets, you have also a ticket. I think that they used to call the pronia. You get it together and I don't know they say that's where you learn the street smarts, or what the guys that used to get the tickets you know, at the Panathinaikos there was the stadium near there was a good team too they take your tickets and they throw them down. So as soon as the gates close, I used to go around and see how many of those pronios that I can get that they look like they were the whole thing there, because they never change it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, also, it's the same ticket every game. Yeah, for the government. Yeah, they never change it. Yeah also, it's the same ticket every every game. Yeah, for this, the government.
Speaker 2:Yeah but the uh soccer team, whatever they're playing, what they had, the government ticket to buy 10 tickets and then I'll set way when people stand in the line to buy tickets. It says tickets and it says how much.
Speaker 2:It says face value because I was getting the the government's right yeah if there was, let's say, $20 for the ticket and $5 for the government. So I used to sell them just like this. Give me that, give me that, give me that. So next time I'll get double the.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I used to make whatever they were playing, I used to make pretty good. And then I think my uncle registered me to go to night school at tech school. Well, I wasn't any tech savvy, that was all new to me. You know the merchant marines and so forth, you know. You know the merchant marines and so forth. You know, and I used to take two buses from the way from home in what they used to call it, to ammonia, to put it near Philadelphia, where the night school was. And I did it for I don't know two or three, four months and I said no, I'm not going to go to that, said no, I'm not going to go to that. So I kept on doing the odd things there and helping my uncle. But that time they got one of those kiosks, you know, selling cigarettes.
Speaker 1:Oh, yes, like a little shop, yeah, oh yes, yeah.
Speaker 2:Like a little shop, yeah, like yeah, and I was helping him a little bit and his brother.
Speaker 2:In 1951, I bought my own little kiosk with my cousin, but I was working that many hours and my cousin never showed up for something like that or whenever he wanted to show up, like theo spiro was when I was working. His shift sometimes is come in for three hours and then the three hours become 12 hours, but anyway, that's something that. So in early 52, I got the good news that Uncle Nick Bardaville, which was living in Lansing Michigan at that time, sent for me to come to the US, and there was another brother of my grandma, so Theo Costa, making arrangements of my grandma, uh-huh. So Theo Costa, american Regiments and Papua Nicole sent $400 at that time for my ticket to come over to the US. Now, did you come over on a boat then? Oh, yes, 17 days, wow, yeah.
Speaker 1:How was that?
Speaker 2:It was up and down. You know, the funny thing was in the high seas. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Everything was really, really good. You know there were plenty of food you can eat all you want to and in the high seas there was on that board there was 700 Greek people, mostly, mostly DPs. You know that there were displaced people. You know I came in under the. I don't know who was. How can you say it? As an immigrant, you had first priority. If you lost your parents, like Theoria did the same thing, theoria, as a matter of fact, lost both of her parents. Yeah.
Speaker 2:One. Her father was in the army and her mother I don't know what she died from, but anyway she came over and we had first priority and when I got the OK that Uncle Nick had sent the money to, it took only 37 days for me to get all the papers and in mere effect, papu, papa at that time, my registration papers that were lost during the war, you know, when they bombarded the villages and they were destroyed. Some of the villages, they did not have anything happen to them, but ours, because that was close to the town of 4,000 or 5,000 people. Right.
Speaker 2:That the Germans and the Italians, they'll look at any forest. If they've seen any movements in any forest, they're bombarding, and you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah a burden, and you know so. How can? So how were you able to find your papers then, since they got destroyed?
Speaker 2:Yes, that's well, papu. Papa, he was living in Perea. That time I was in Athens, he was living in Piraeus. At that time I was in Athens, he was in Piraeus. So he says well, we have an arrangement to go and see a judge to give you a certificate for you're born and all this and that. So I said, okay, I met him. We went to the court, papu, papa Vageli, at that time you know, big beard, very nice, trim, you know, and very distinguished looking. And I was behind him and the judge says Pater, you know this individual. He says yes, and who is this individual? He says yes, and who is this individual? It's my nephew's child and he was born. When was he born? He says September 12, 1935. I didn't say nothing and I said after we got out Papu, I wasn't born September 12, 1935. I was born June 20, 1935. And he says ah, you know nothing to it.
Speaker 1:you know we got the year right, so and what did you say?
Speaker 2:Well, I think there was something that happened with my yaya and that they became to his mind and his head.
Speaker 1:So you got a new birthday out of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, nowadays they on my papers they say September 12, 1935.
Speaker 2:But I never celebrated, oh my, so you were able to get your paperwork, yeah, and then go through all the departments to sign off that I wasn't a bad individual, I wasn't committing any crimes or I wasn't a communist, and all this and that. So I was taking them by hand to each department to make sure that they sign up and you had to pay the government step so they stamp it, and I think I had done it 28 or 29 days the whole thing, and that took the last week. I went to the village, I went to get a study and I went to see my folks and my siblings and my mother at that time said Bye, sonny, I'll probably never see you again. Oh, oh.
Speaker 1:Was she happy for you that you were coming to the United States? Yes, were they happy for you that you were?
Speaker 2:coming to the.
Speaker 1:United States.
Speaker 2:Yes, but I said, mom, people meet again, but mountains don't. I remember that.
Speaker 1:I don't know why I'm so sentimental, but Well, she's your mother, and that must have been very difficult. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Great lady.
Speaker 1:She did what she could right.
Speaker 2:She took care of you as best she could you know when Theoria and I, 1973, went back for my brother's wedding. And. I don't know. We took a couple weeks off and I went to the village. I had rented a car so we went to pick up mom you know, stay with him a little bit to go to Theoria's village. And you know, when I was going through, you know, I said mom, you should be friends with everybody in the village. And he says I am son. But that no good son of a and that, good lady, I'll never be friends.
Speaker 2:You know because, and I know why, when we were lost our dad, some of the people in the village took advantage of the farm or whatever the trees at my dad. You know, because we had some trees almond trees, walnut trees, olive trees, apple trees, you know, for the year's food supply Right, so they must went to rip it off. So my mother never made friends with them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, never forgot.
Speaker 2:No no.
Speaker 1:So in 1973, you did see your mother again then oh yeah, well, I went in 68 with Johnny.
Speaker 2:Okay, you know that's what is it. It's a picture of Johnny. Where is it? It's a picture of Johnny. I took her. She was sick with anemia, but I did not go to different places or just like when we were in 73.
Speaker 1:So if we can go back a little bit to your, you said goodbye to your family and then did you so. Then you got on the boat to come to the United States.
Speaker 2:Yes, and I went to Piraeus with Theo Costa and Thierry Rini. They were escorting me there and you know they were wonderful. Your constant theory neither were more than parents mm-hmm, they did more than they had to oh, they took care of you right? Oh yeah, you know so, and I never forgot my Theo Costa and Theo Rini now.
Speaker 1:Did you see them again after?
Speaker 2:you came many times oh good good and not only that. I spoke to Theo Costa in his name day in Christmas, whatever. I talked to him at least two or three times a year and he says to me many times nephew, with all the nephews and nieces that I have, you're the only one call me and thank me and see how we are. So you know, if somebody treats you good, you better. Treat them better, Right yeah.
Speaker 1:Yes, so tell me about your trip here. And then, what was it like when you got to the United States? So what was that like for you?
Speaker 2:Well, it wasn't easy. I arrived at Ellis Island, which I did not know at that time. It was Ellis Island, uh-huh, and we were at the Ellis Island for a whole day. I went there about 10, 12 years ago to see Ellis Island. It looks beautiful now, but those days 1952, it wasn't nothing like it's today. I don't know if you've ever been there to see.
Speaker 1:I have. I have.
Speaker 2:Now they have all the names of people and we find my name there, but we're sending cross legs right there for 24 hours to be processed. And when I was processed there I got into a train and says well, you're going to Detroit On the way, you know, because my last meal that was probably about 5 o'clock the day before, when we were at the Ellis Island. There was no food served for 24 hours. Oh, and I had $4 in my name, $4 in my name. And when I went to get something to eat and I see people they were getting, as I found out later on, ham and cheese sandwiches and Coca-Cola and I said, you know, indicate to take that. And I put the $4 right there and he took it and I took a bite and I thought there was rotten.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and when I took a drink of Coca-Cola I thought there was poison. Oh no, because you know, in Greece I was getting used to the feta cheese. And then, you know, I was the portocolada, you know the orange drink.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:And there was no such thing of what I got, that ham and cheese sandwich in the Coca-Cola. It wasn't exactly fresh either, like in Greece, and I was in the middle of the train and I see people going left, people going right and there was like a doctor first time I ever saw. I seen Egyptian before but I'd never seen a black person and I said there's my aunt outside in Greek. And then when his eyes, those white eyes and the black face I never forget it.
Speaker 2:He had no idea what you were saying so I told and I said after everybody went, the rest all right. And I said I'm going to stay right here because my Uncle, nick's daughter was going to pick me up. I'm not going to move. So next thing I know, after a lady was coming and I thought that there was my Aunt Mary. You know that, curliss. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I said, oh, tia Maria, no, so come here. No, so come here. So I went and then my Aunt Mary was waiting outside the gated door oh, okay, to pick me up and at that time she was married to Harold Goldmeister and we stopped at Warren. That was where her Papunico, theonico and Thea Magdalene- so where did they live? In Lansing 420 North Butler Street.
Speaker 1:Oh, I know that area very well.
Speaker 2:They were next to Genesee Grade School.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't think Genesee Grade School is there anymore but, yeah, North Butler, I know where that's at. So what did your Theo Nico do for work?
Speaker 2:Well, he was in the restaurant business, uh-huh. And he, when I came here, he wasn't that good of a help. He had a little restaurant called Bard's Restaurant. What is it Say? You know, enlarge Okay. And then I went to West Junior a little bit and after about a year or so he had another Nick Bardaville, first cousin in Maplazan, and he got sick. And Uncle Nick says to me, because he had a restaurant, says Nick Bartaville needs a little help, nick Bardaville needs a little help.
Speaker 2:Well, I had learned a little bit terrestrial business yeah with him at Bard's and I went up there for about a year and a half or so, but not pleasant. It was more of a college town than anything else.
Speaker 1:At that time that was all there was was Central Michigan University right and not a lot else.
Speaker 2:I remember 7,000 students and I think it was less. The students were more than the Mount Pleasant residents. After a couple years I told Phil Sanders, which was Uncle Nick Bardaville's at that time son-in-law I said, phil, I'm going back to Lansing and there was. You know Phil was going to what? There was a deal if I go there, we should become partners, uh-huh, but anyway, I saw Phil was reluctant and I know why he was reluctant because of his wife. And I said I learned a good lesson. And I left Phil and says well, I know you're going to do well in life. You're going to do well in life. He was at that time, I was probably 20 years old and he was 38.
Speaker 2:And I came back to Lansing and I went to Sexton's for I don't know how long I stayed there for anyway and I went to Sexton and I that time I said you know, uncle Harry, that summer of 57 or the fall of 57 or something that you can come and help me. So I did that. And then Chris Cadillanes was supposed to register for the army, because if you're once, you're 18, you had to register for the military right and I took chris katayannis on may street.
Speaker 2:On May Street where there was a registration offices that time and Chris registered his name, you know, because at that time Chris was freshly coming to this country, he did not know any English at all. And I remember the lady says to me did you register yourself? And I said yes, I registered. And what's your name? I told her and I said where are you looking? Oh, it says you're up for draft. Uh-huh.
Speaker 2:So I said I am. He says yeah, and I said, well, if I'm going to be drafted, I'll be ready. And February 18, 1957, I went to the Army. Oh, and I said good, now I don't have to work. I don't have to. You know, take it easy a little bit.
Speaker 1:Is that what you thought? Yeah, oh Not that easy though. No, no. So where did you go for your basic training when you first came into the Army?
Speaker 2:Well, you know, processing center, there was four-letter word and it was funny At four-letter word, I don't know if there was a first night or a second night. They say we're going to have a first night or a second night. They say we're going to have a GI party, party. Oh good, yeah, and I was too naive, you know, right, right. And it says you, you, you pick up a mop, you, you, you pick up a broom, you, you, you. So I, you pick up a broom, you, you, you. So I said that's a GI party.
Speaker 1:Not the kind of party you were expecting, was it Not at all?
Speaker 2:And then we went to Fort Carson and there was a rough second eight. I mean the first eight, because there was March and April, halfway up to Pikes Peak.
Speaker 1:You, been there, bill. I have not been to Fort Carson no. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Well and they got. They call it the Agony Hill. Uh-huh. And that time you gotta, you gotta go up for bivouac and I remember you pull your foot up and one foot goes down into the mud and you pick up and that was a pretty rough time. A lot of people from or, let's say, california or Florida, mm-hmm. When you're a close to Pikes Peak or four mile, well, it's's Denver, it's the mile city.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, denver, the mile high city, the air is different, right yeah?
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely yeah, yeah. So a lot of people did not made it. Art made it at 118 pounds and a full pack of 62 pounds in his back.
Speaker 1:Your pack weighed almost as much as you did, yeah, so you weren't taking it easy. It doesn't sound like it wasn't what you thought it was, no. No but it got better. Yeah, you were eight weeks at Fort Carson then, is that yeah?
Speaker 2:Okay, and eight weeks at Fort Chaffee, arkansas.
Speaker 1:No, I've never heard of that. That must not be there anymore. Fort Chaffee, arkansas. What did you do there?
Speaker 2:I went to clerk type of school. Uh-huh. You know, normally not normally, but I after my. Well, no, there was. Yeah, fort Chaffee. Did you ever heard Fort Smith?
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Well, that was part of Fort Smith, Okay, Okay. And there we went to Clortypus and most of the fellows graduating they were sent to Germany and I applied.
Speaker 2:You know well, I don't know if I applied or told I would like to go to Germany, but because I wasn't an American citizen I couldn't go to Germany. Oh yeah, so I stayed for Chaffee an extra week or two or so to get some orders from the Pentagon and they sent me to Fort Hood, texas. And I said at that time yeah, they sent me in a foreign country, it's Texas.
Speaker 1:It must have felt like a foreign country, huh.
Speaker 2:But you know, I was lucky there. I got assigned to personnel where we had the new troops coming in that were making the second missile command, Mm-hmm missile command, and I stayed probably about a month and first sergeant he asked me, Arvanites, come here. And I said okay, this is Lieutenant Woodbeck. And he says Lieutenant Woodbeck needs someone to go and create an airstrip. This was all new to me and I said I don't know. And his name was Sergeant Welch. He was really nice, A young man. I think he was made a first sergeant during the Korea, you know, I guess he made his rank by, but a good young man.
Speaker 2:So I went to the airstrip we start getting and this is Lieutenant. He says, don't worry about it, we've got everything all set. And then when I left the aviation wing at that time they called it the aviation wing they had 300 pilots and probably 60 or 70 fixed wing, little L-19s and probably a dozen of H-13s and some H-34s, because that's, how can I remember all of that?
Speaker 1:I know. That's 60 years ago. Some things you just remember, right. Yeah, that's a pretty good size air wing, though that's a lot of people.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Well, and then you know, I got my citizenship in Austin, Texas.
Speaker 1:So you got that while you were still in the Army.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I had to have a witness with me. So I picked up a real friend of mine which was another draftee. His name was Hunt. We went to Austin, there to the court, and when the judge saw that Aristides Arvanites, would you like to change your name to Americanize it I said no, your Honor, that's my God-given name. Come on, I give you 15 minutes to think about it. And I said, your Honor, I thought about it. This is my name and I'm not going thought about it. This is my name and I'm not gonna change it. So okay, so I got my citizenship and I was happy for it. Yeah.
Speaker 2:But now I did not use Aristides that much, except on my legal papers.
Speaker 1:It's still your name, though.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so being a clerk typist, did that help you with your English?
Speaker 2:I think so.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I remember that time. You know, I think there was at one time that I could type 57 words a minute. That was pretty good, yeah, that's. But now I don't know if I remember the keys.
Speaker 1:Now, do you sort of just use two fingers and type, or do you still type like you?
Speaker 2:No, I did not use two figures at Fort Chaffee. Uh-huh, that ought us to A lot of the soldiers at Fort Chaffee. They were probably not only high school graduates, but college graduates. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1:So you got your citizenship in Austin and then did you stay at Fort Hood, then the rest of your time in the Army yes, okay. And how long were you in? I was for two years. Okay, I was for two years.
Speaker 2:Okay, Probably well. I was the February 18th when I was in the Army. I probably got out of there probably a couple weeks early because of leave time. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And did you come back to Lansing then, or did you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, okay. Well, I was going to stay in Texas. I had found a person. They had a restaurant I think they call it the Elite at that time, anyway but then I was talking to Uncle Nick and Uncle Nick had slept and broke his leg, slipped on ice, uh-huh, broke his leg and Theomar Gdaldini says well, theonique needs some help, needs some help. So I got into the bus and I came to Lansing, you know, because I had an obligation Right. Yeah.
Speaker 1:So you helped out. How long did you stay at the restaurant then?
Speaker 2:So you helped out. How long did you? Stay at the restaurant then no, I didn't, I had met them before. I used to go to Waco, Texas. They had a Greek church there go once a while, and then they had a visiting priest. They used to come to Fort Hood once in a while, so I had met him. Okay, or they had that, so I didn't stay there. But he says well, if you get out from the army, you know the Greeks, they promise you a lot of things yes so you.
Speaker 1:You came back to Lansing then and helped your Theo.
Speaker 2:Nico right yeah and is so.
Speaker 1:He still had the same restaurant.
Speaker 2:No, do you have? Did he have a different? He could not work, that he had medical problems. Okay, you know he lived to be 96 years old and we lost the Amagdaleny in 1961 from a heart attack.
Speaker 1:So but so then, what did you do when you came back? What were you?
Speaker 2:Well, I went to work, hopefully for Fisher, but I look around, you know, a couple weeks, you know. When we got out from the Army they said I remember Captain. Anyway, he says you have 90 days to make. And I had a couple weeks look around and so I went to Fisher body apply for it. This is you just got out from the army. Yeah, this is you can start work tonight. You don't have to take a physical. So I said what work would I have to do? So he took me and says well, you can work right here. And I said sparks flying all over.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that was what they called the pits. That's where you weld. You know, you got two 20-pounds of welding guns and I'm 118 pounds and flares flying about 30 feet away. And I looked there's six guys in the pits, their t-shirts burnt and I said well, what else do you have to do? He says you work there four to six months and then you can transfer to whatever, and I said okay and I just walked out yeah, it doesn't sound like a very safe place to be.
Speaker 2:Well now I learned that when Mark both Huey and Mark they worked at Fisher and they did not have to do that. But that's the hardest job. Yeah. So, anyway, and I went right across to Uncle Harry again and Uncle Harry says well, I need someone to help me with Harris. And I said well, you know, I'm planning to get married, you know.
Speaker 2:I never thought that I'd get married to Ria. But I said that's my plans and what is for me. And I said, well, he says you work. Well, no, what did I? I said when you're ready to sell, would you give me the first choice? And Uncle Harry, you know, was a man of honor, you know, would give you a shake, right, a man of honor, you know, he'd give you a check, figured there was. And we made a deal that I'll take care.
Speaker 2:And then in 1960, there were three license liquor license. Uncle Harry had beer and wine. There were three liquor license issued to the city of Lansing. So I said to Uncle Harry I'm going to apply for liquor license. Oh, he says, dami, I did all right with beer and wine. And I said I don't think that will do. So I went to the city hall and put an application in. It says how many years of experience you have in a restaurant? Oh, I said a couple years. It says it's not enough, you've got to have at least five years. So I said five years. Oh, uncle Harry has 45. So I went back and I said Uncle Harry, you got to apply for this liquor license. Oh, tommy, I did all right, I don't need that and I said, yes, you do.
Speaker 2:So I convinced him he will fill up the application and it took me eight months every Monday night going to the city council night, going to the City Council to get the license, and I remember the one of the councilman says well, you gotta change, here is here because there was a factory bar Right and you've got to change it. Put carpet in. And yes sir, yes sir. How stupid they were, but you had to agree.
Speaker 1:Right right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, but you had to agree, right, right, yeah. So after eight months Uncle Harry got a liquor license and on that liquor license there was a stipulation the individual receives that cannot sell that liquor license unless there's this this up and says call Tom Sinas to make the cell. So you know, uncle Harry never remembered that was from the first day that the liquor license was issued to him. Before we do that, we got to come in into the price because to buy it and you know the way he said, you give me so much down, so much amount, triple net. I don't want you to, maria, have to have any taxes, any insurance, any utilities or any of this. And I said, okay, just tell me what money I have to come up. So he was fair. But, maria, at that time when we got the liquor, the business had doubled.
Speaker 2:She wasn't willing to depart from you know. But Uncle Harry says, don't listen to Maria. And you know it was a blessing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no-transcript.
Speaker 2:Still there, harry. I think let's say 2005, 2007,. Took a couple of. We tried different things and you know music I didn't like music, it's not my cup of tea. Full restaurant I don't want it, because when I was in Maplazan that was full restaurant. You had to make pies, you had to do this and that, soups and gravies and specials, and all this and that, and you have to have a chef and chefs. They're terrible and I learned that by buying Johnny's. You know where the Taco Bell is on West Side, you know.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:There was Theo's before, yes, and then I bought it. That's where I made it to Johnny's. But I was waiting to buy a liquor license and I bought a liquor license and then made it to a. You know, you make more money out of liquor because you have no waste. The only waste you have if your bartender gives drinks away, right. And the thing with Jonas is after spending a ton of money to remodel it and put the bar in and all this and that All new makeup here.
Speaker 2:Anyway, I was talking one day machine at Harry's and it's a new element. Okay, art says, but I cannot be there after six. I said, okay, I'll wait for you, I cannot be there after six. I said okay, I'll wait for you. And when we met after six he says you know, I left Brothers and I'm working for Taco Bell. I said oh yeah, mike, what's says?
Speaker 2:Taco Bell has 13 Taco Bells that he owns and he wants somebody to take care of the equipment inside and out. And he said he has a Taco Bell on West Side you know that was on the right side and the guy gives him a hard time and he says he's looking for a place to move it. I said, well, I got to the right place here. I was spending pretty near $400,000 to remodel it. And he says, well, how big is it? I said, well, it's just a little under an acre and a half. I said, well, he needs an acre. Well, I cannot cut it. I said here's my card. Give it to Pete and if he's interested he can call me. So couple days later I get a call. This is Pete. Whatever from Taco Bell. You talk to Michael Gorman. Whatever from Taco Bell. You talk to Michael Gorman. And I said yes. And he says how much you want for the piece of property? I said the piece of property is not for sale. I said I'll lease it for you. He says how? Much you want.
Speaker 2:Well, at the time I said I want at least $6,500 to pay the note and I said another $1,500 to $2,000 for the money for myself. Oh, it's just art, it's too much. We're selling tacos for 69 cents. It's very, very expensive. 69 cents, it's very expensive. Well, pete, that's what it is. I said you did not make no money out of tacos. You make out of money of selling the pub and tacos. You make a lot of money of selling a pop. And I said you get a pop for 10, 15 cents, a glass they cost you and you sell it for 79, 89, 99. That's where you make your money. It says well, I cannot dispute that. It says let me think about it. And a couple days later it says okay, I have an attorney, throw the papers. And I said don't forget, I'm not going to spend any money anymore to tear down the building. If you do that and if we have to auction anything out, I get the benefit.
Speaker 2:And the license? Are you going to use the license? No, I said the license comes back to me, right, so that was a good deal.
Speaker 1:It sounds like it, so I'm just curious so did Joni's ever open? Oh yeah, okay, so they were open and running for a while before you. Yeah, okay.
Speaker 2:Well, Tina was the manager, Uh-huh, and she just had Shannon and Adam was probably about a year and you know, you have about 40 employees or something like that and they're not the best intelligent people to work with. And I saw Tina F this F that you know, the cook and that's what I said. You know it's punishing my girls.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was time to do something different, right? So I want to go back a little bit. You bought the bar and restaurant in 1965. When did you meet Theoria?
Speaker 2:Well that time we were made and then we started dating and then we got married in the fall of 69.
Speaker 1:Okay, so you had already established your business. How did you meet?
Speaker 2:I met through probably church Okay.
Speaker 1:And you got married in 69, and then you had how many children.
Speaker 2:Well, we had Johnny in 63. Okay, 62. And Harry. You know, because I said to Ria we're not going to have any kids that in three years you know we're not going to have any kids to be in diapers and have you know more, right? So they gotta be apart. So you know we, harriet was born in 65. And Tina was born in 68. Christopher was born in 68., christopher was born in 73.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right, so you had them nicely spaced out then.
Speaker 2:Well, I didn't want Rhea to have kids to. You know, two kids in diapers. Right. So, and if you go somewhere you don't have to have one, he goes, thank god, you know. I I said to the area work hard but enjoy life right and we used to go two weeks every winter when Fisher Body was taking those two weeks off Right.
Speaker 1:So for people listening to this, just so they get the idea, Harry's was right across from Fisher Body. Oh yeah, and Fisher Body was like your main business 95%. Yes, so you would, when they would do their changeover or whatever, you would go on vacation, because they were all on vacation. Basically, yeah, yeah, okay.
Speaker 2:They used to take a couple weeks off during Christmas, New Year and a couple weeks off during the summer for retooling.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:So that was the opportunity for us to get together with our family.
Speaker 1:So my father worked for Oldsmobile.
Speaker 2:Well, same. Thing.
Speaker 1:Every year in July for two weeks they would do changeover retooling and so we would go on vacation. I remember those days back in the 70s and early 80s.
Speaker 2:Yeah well, they kept up until I don't know if they're still doing it or I'm pretty sure they're still doing it, so it worked out good, so with four children.
Speaker 1:So I take it Joni's was named after your daughter, your firstborn. After my mother, after your mother, okay? Okay.
Speaker 2:So her name was Joni Helene. Oh, my mother, andrea's mother.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, that's nice, that's. You know, bill, I never, you know. I know I get a little bit. I call it sentimental or emotional, but I never regret the tough times. I always I said it's a better day tomorrow. I always, you know, enjoy and thank God that it worked that way.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, I think those tough times make you who you are right.
Speaker 2:Sometimes you go through those things and it you know they say well, it depends what you're associating with. Yeah, you can associate somebody that you can learn, or you can associate somebody that's down to the dumps. Which one you want to be?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I want to learn right.
Speaker 2:You know, like when my and one of my father's brothers, my father's brothers, see we're talking, one time it says, well, tell me, art, how do in USA, how do you doing over there? I said, thea, I'm living the life of a prince, beautiful, you know. Mm-hmm. And thank God that you know to have the health and to do the things that's good for everybody, good for your family, and don't try to hurt anybody. Try to help somebody.
Speaker 1:Try to help somebody Well, and also for people listening to this, when you talk about health. You're 90 years old and I know that you do your own landscaping and you take care of your property. You do a lot of things that some people don't understand how you can do it, but I think it's because you've. I think it's because you've maintained your health and you have a healthy attitude towards life.
Speaker 2:God bless. If you don't have good health, you got nothing. Right. So thank the Almighty for bestowing good health on you. Absolutely. We had our ups and downs with health, but thanks to the good doctors too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, they're here for a reason. Yeah. I want to talk a little bit about your family, so tell me about your children, sure Well, or tell me what you'd like to share about your children.
Speaker 2:I love them all. Yeah. I'll tell you we're blessed. We're having, you know, of course, losing Johnny. That was devastating. Yeah. But, thank God, we got Terri, tina and Christopher. We got Haria, tina and Christopher. We could not ask for better children. Haria is married, has three children herself and she's she's the joy of my heart, tina. She's married, she has two children of her own and one of her husband, which is more than her own child, and she's Tina the Terror. She's hardworking, intelligent you name it and Christopher, of course, you know.
Speaker 1:Oh, I know. Yes, well, I know all three of them actually, but yes. Christopher, yes.
Speaker 2:The only thing I used to say to him son, go ahead, get married, settle down. Son, go ahead, get married, settle down. But now today he's going to Portugal.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for two weeks. Well, all of your children work very hard. They're hard workers.
Speaker 2:Oh, absolutely. And they say, God, that we learned from you to take pride of our work and take pride of our family. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:And the what's the proper word? They say the Todas. Oh, anyway, some of those words, you know it has an effect of. When I had, six years ago, this stroke, it took away from my memory. I used to, you know, people used to write down the old days, the telephone numbers. I wrote it down once and that was it. I remember it. When I used to call different suppliers or different people, I used to say I've a hole.
Speaker 1:You remember the old days, the I've a hole. Yeah, so you had two letters and then numbers, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Now I'm a little young for that.
Speaker 2:Oh, you're way, way different generation.
Speaker 1:Yes, but I know what you're talking about because I remember my parents talking about it. Yes, we still had a party line when I was a kid, where people shared.
Speaker 2:Listen listen, listen to somebody else yes, yes.
Speaker 1:Or someone would listen and you could tell when they were listening to your else yes, yes, or someone would listen and you could tell when they were listening to your conversations. So yeah, I do remember that.
Speaker 2:But well, thank God it's still, I can find my way around. Let's put it that way it's important, that's very important.
Speaker 1:I want to talk a little bit about you too. So you Harry's Place is still running strong and that's still in the family. But you've had other restaurants and other businesses and you've been very successful.
Speaker 2:Well, I don't know if that's what you call it Bill, that what you call it, bill, but I know I used to get involved with different things, yes, and I used to get upset. When I find difficulties, I start out with Harry's and then Uncle Nick had a piece of property on Beverly and Grand River and he was trying to rezone it and he had opposition from the neighbors. He had opposition from the neighbors and he says to me we tried to resolve this and these neighbors, they were objecting, and I said who's these neighbors? Oh, this is Mr Colbert. And I went there, talked to him in 1968, and I said to him Mr Colbert, would you like to sell this raw land? He says I would. And I says I would. And I said, okay, I'll give you that time. You know there was, I'll give you $15,000 for it. Oh, no, it's just, I don't know, it's 2025.
Speaker 2:We agree anyway in 17, in 1968, which it was good money, right, and I said, well, I'll tell you what I will do. I'll give you a down payment and I'll pay you every month down payment and I pay you every month. So there was a deal that took away. You know, fox Island is an well they used to own by Mr Bartleville and when I bought it they brought it up to and there was nobody Against it and that's where Jim Fox bought it and put Fox Island and those apartments. So from there I Failed the 1978 Louv La Hague Lucas and I built those 40 units on.
Speaker 2:Journey Circle and I kept the front that I put in later on the Arvanites Retail Center and I sold it last year Because now I sold just about everything and from there we got to East Lansing. I used to say to Theoria, I'll never get involved in another project. And then a couple months later another idea was coming and then I get involved and she says what happened when you said that I'll never get involved with another project, well, I said that was then.
Speaker 1:Yeah, this is now right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, we had a lot of fun. I don't know, Christopher. He asked me one time says how many projects you get involved? And I said I don't know, son, and really I never really sat down because I traded Like when we bought Johnny's, theo's out, I traded him with an office building I had on michigan avenue and uh, weverly west from uh, michigan avenue. Yeah, there was an office building there. I ran that office building for a few years and and then there was a time there and I said, well, I'll sell that one to get that one. You know so Right.
Speaker 1:A lot of wheeling and dealing. It sounds like lots of so. So were you and louis of la jaca's business partners for a while then uh, we were for the for 2000 building and hagedorn and grand river. Okay on Hagedorn and Grand River.
Speaker 2:Okay, and then when we were, we built the apartments and Louis at that time says I got to get out from the apartments so we can buy the Golden Gate with Jim Christofil. Yeah, and then John Christofil had it later. So, yeah, we were in two projects with Louie.
Speaker 1:Okay, but it sounds like there's a lot of businesses around like Lansing and East Lansing that you had a part of then.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I started with Lake Lansing. I had bought 40 acres of Lake Lansing back in 71, 72, to put a mobile home park in there. And then Bill what was it? Bill Sod, or that was the drain. Commissioner for AM County.
Speaker 1:That was probably before my time. I was born in 65, so yeah, somewhere yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you were a young man. He came in I bought it for 40 grand on land contract and they because there was two different cells they came in and they wanted to drain, and it says they wanted to drain the Lake Lansing. Oh, they went to Mr White which had some, you know, a lot of.
Speaker 1:White Hills. Yeah, yeah, he built a lot of homes in East Lansing.
Speaker 2:He, and then he will never let them put a drench, all the debris and everything. And so it says to me I will give you $80,000. And I said no. As a matter of fact, he came into the old Harry's before I remodeled and you know we're dealing and wheeling back and forth, and it says well, my people said that we will not give you no more than 80 grand, but we'll. I think there was. The beginning was yeah, I said to make a golf course After we drench it. You can have that and make a golf course. And I said make a golf course. And I said make a golf course. You know it'll take a lot of money and 40 acres, it's not a big golf course, right? So I said give me $120,000 and you can have it. This was at Harry's. And he says no, there's no way we're going to give you $120,000. So I said you're wasting my time then. And then he goes to the telephone, which there was a telephone booth inside Harry's with a pay phone, right yeah, it says okay, we'll give you 120.
Speaker 2:That was one of the deals, so I want to make sure I understand this.
Speaker 1:You bought it on land that was one of the deals. So I want to make sure I understand this. So you bought it on land contracts, so you didn't really completely own it yet, but you tripled your money by making that sale. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Wow, wow. Oh yeah, louie Mike and I bought 17 acres on Jolly Road for having something with the Army.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, the enlistment building there, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we bought it for $170 on a land contract and we sold it to 17 acres to the Army enlisted for $570. Wow, wow, then I took that money.
Speaker 1:You know, take it from one, put it to the other Right Always investing in your own business too. So that's.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, if you don't take no chances, you know not all like the East Lansing. You know, not all like the East Lansing. We had bought that Fortunity House back in 72. And you know we had those psychologists in there. Well, in 20, in 2025 years later, that building was obsolete to for office. Right, so we took a chance and we spent a lot of money. But you know, we wanted to not to have an office building but to have a little retail center. We figure, with Michigan State, a little retail center will do much better, like a pizza place and a 7-Eleven or something like that. But the city said no, yeah, yeah. So I don't know I was. You know we had heard GM was going to put a tunnel from Fisher Body to Oldsmobile for setting the bodies over.
Speaker 2:Right so we went and bought with Gus and I and Bill Gus I had brought him from Fisherbody to work back in 1965 I was a Greek boy and we bought his cousin Bill from Montreal. He was from Greece to Germany to Montreal to here, to at that time to be the cook or the chef for Harry's. But I told him, you know, we can do things together, and we can because you know to pay big wages is not feasible, right, but if we do other things, and we agree, and we bought nine, ten pieces of properties right under Rosemary and what's the other street there.
Speaker 2:Anyway, all that in one section. If Fisherbody had to make a move, they had to see us first.
Speaker 1:Right, right, they never built that tunnel, though, did they? No, but you were able to move the properties, right, yeah, right, they never built that tunnel, though did they, but you were able to move the properties right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, oh, after well, I told Gus and Bill yeah, there were nine pieces of property and we put a price on all of them. But I said make a package. If you get the or B property or C property, it's equal value Not to have one up and one Right. And then I set them on the table and that time we had those big cigarette trays, uh-huh, and I had made on paper. I had wrote property A is worth $25,000. Property B is worth $25,000. Property C worth $25,000. It was worth $25,000. Property C worth $25,000.
Speaker 2:And I said that we'll shake it up, we'll put it in the ashtray and under the table and that's it. And you take it and shake it, and I take it and shake it, and Bill take it, or Gus, and then you draw it. And I said, bill, you're the oldest, you want to draw. No, I said Gus, you want to draw because I'm going to be the last one. I don't want guys to say well, you knew which one to Right. And I said I don't want you guys to. So I says okay, gus, he, yeah, all that he got. Or Gus's bar West on West Michigan Avenue right next to Safeway. Yeah, he got that one and I got three of his property. I sold them later on, you know Well, in matter of fact, I have one of the houses that's right across from the Union Hall, the 602. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Right across the street that I gave it to Harry. I said you know, I'm not going to take care of it. I used to take care of it, you know go, I used to take care of it, you know go. I said Hugh is going to you know you and Matthew, it's your house now. So you know. Same thing, the Genesee house I call it Because I had bought all the properties around Harris. Yeah, that way back in 70s they used to complain. The neighbors complained that on 2.30, the bar was closing, people they were drinking in the parking lot. Or Fisher Body was, I don't know if you remember when Fisher Body had those old windows, yes, and they closed all the windows because the neighbors were complaining, because the neighbors were complaining. So I had bought three houses around and a lot behind. So I used it as a buffer zone.
Speaker 1:Right, nobody can complain because it's your property, yeah.
Speaker 2:Even though I used to buy it on a land contract. I remember, yeah, I got 15 for that one, 17 for the other house behind it, mm-hmm. So and those I did pay cash because for 17,. For six months, for six months that his son's trying to close the estate and I said to him when he agreed, I said one stipulation, said what's that, the old grand piano that you have in there? I want it for the same price. So he gave me the piano and that time I got a couple guys from Fisher Body, strong guys, because it's heavy, right now it's out in the garage.
Speaker 2:I said I don't know anything about music and Ria knows nothing about music. I want my kids to learn music, so Ria knew nothing about it. I took the piano, put it on Shannon's Lane At that time we were living on Shannon's Lane and Ria says what is that? And I said piano. That the kids couldn't learn to play the piano. I don't know. That was probably. I don't think Christopher was born yet, I don't know and all three of them learned music.
Speaker 1:That's great. Yeah, that is. Yeah, that is.
Speaker 2:A lot of funny things happen in life, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's a great story, though I mean that's fantastic. So we've talked about a lot of stuff today. We've covered a lot of things. Is there anything that we haven't talked about that you want to talk about? Is there anything that we've missed?
Speaker 2:Well, you know, have God bestow us with good health till the time comes to leave this earth. I think that's probably Ria and I, and all of us wish not to be a burden to anybody.
Speaker 1:Well then, I want to ask you one more question, and then we'll stop for the day. So I ask everyone the same question, and that is you know, years from now, when people are listening to these stories of people's lives, what would you like? What message would you leave for people? What, what piece of advice would you give to people that are going to hear this?
Speaker 2:years from now? Well, I don't know. Work hard, be happy and enjoy life. You know, be honest to your fellow citizens, don't harm anybody, don't harm you. So I don't know, bill.
Speaker 1:I think that's good. I think that's good. Well, thanks for taking the afternoon and sitting here answering all my questions. I've learned so much about you now. This has been really good.
Speaker 2:Well, I'm glad that you came over and we spent pretty near. This has been really good. Well, I'm glad that you came over and we spent pretty near two hours almost, I think.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's been a little time it's beautiful.
Speaker 2:I like it. Now I get to know you and you get to know me.
Speaker 1:I do, I do.
Speaker 2:I do, it's fantastic.
