Veterans Archives: Preserving the Stories of our Nations Heroes
In a world where storytelling has been our link to the past since the days of cave drawings, there exists a timeless tradition. It's the art of passing down knowledge, and for Military Veterans, it's a crucial piece of their legacy. Join us on the Veterans Archives Podcast, where we dive deep into the heartwarming and awe-inspiring stories of those who served, no matter when or where.
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Veterans Archives: Preserving the Stories of our Nations Heroes
When Chaos Feels Like Comfort (Sam Juan)
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Chaos can feel like home when you grow up inside it, and that one truth threads through every turn of Sam Juan’s life. Sam was born and raised in Bahrain on a close-knit compound, then moved to California as a teenager and landed in a world that felt unsafe, isolating, and far from the community she knew. From adoption and family tension to surviving abuse and learning to dissociate, she explains how the body learns what it must to keep going, and how those “skills” can follow you for decades.
We talk about finding escape and belonging through sports, friendship, and rave culture, then getting a recruiter call that changes everything. Sam joins the US Army as a non-citizen, hits the wall of limited job options, and still thrives in basic training because structure and recognition finally make sense. Her story moves through Germany, solo travel, and reclaiming Filipino heritage through deeply researched tribal tattoos, then through a hard pivot: leaving the Army, spiraling into high-risk choices, and reenlisting to regain accountability.
From Hawaii intelligence work and motherhood, she pushes toward the Cultural Support Team program and later deploys to Afghanistan with Red Squadron of SEAL Team 6, describing the pressure, the pride, and the moral complexity that can leave lasting injury. The comedown is real: art school, addiction, relationship collapse, and the moment she finally asks for help. Sam shares her path through psychedelic therapy for veterans, integration work, and ibogaine treatment for opioid addiction, plus what sobriety since July 2023 has made possible. If you care about veteran mental health, PTSD recovery, moral injury, and real-world healing journeys, you will take a lot from this conversation. Subscribe, share this with someone who needs it, and leave a review with the line that stayed with you most.
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Bahrain Roots And Big Move
SPEAKER_03Today is Monday, August 10th, 2026. We're speaking with Sam Juan, who served the United States Army. So good afternoon.
SPEAKER_00Hey there. Good afternoon. Thanks for having me.
SPEAKER_03Thanks for joining us. We do appreciate it. So we'll just jump right in. Tough question right off the bat. When and where were you born?
SPEAKER_00Born and raised in Bahrain, a little island off of Saudi Arabia's coast, uh, October 19th, 1984, and spent basically my childhood there up until about age 13 or 14 before I moved to California.
SPEAKER_03Okay. And um talk to me about your childhood there. What was that like?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, um I it's very unique uh upbringing. I grew up on a compound where my father worked for this company called Special Projects and specifically for the Prime Minister of Bahrain. And everyone that worked on this project lived within the compound. So almost like living on base, but um for for their government. And let's see, we had you know a park in there that you know the kids were very communal. We would have monthly um celebrations, so we'll do like almost like a monthly potluck, but grander scale, you know, maybe a couple hundred people would show up. Um and we do dances, we do races, you know, uh three-legged races. Uh what's the one where you like uh have your lower body in a rice sack?
SPEAKER_03A sac race. It's a sac race, yeah. I know what you're talking about.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. Um, so it's really, you know, safe and communal, um, is what I want to bring out of this whole um part. Um and then the school. So I went to a British curriculum school, and a lot of expats from surrounding countries um were classmates there, or a lot from the UK. So very diverse. Um yeah. Uh so growing up there, um, that's pretty much how it was like, very safe. Um and I eventually, you know, I had family here in California. Well, not here, I'm in Virginia, but in California. So growing up periodically, we'd go visit aunts and uncles that lived in the U.S. Um, but I didn't move permanently until I was 14. Okay.
SPEAKER_03Um, what about brothers and sisters?
SPEAKER_00Um, so I'm adopted. Um my parents adopted me when they were about 50 years old, and I was about a month, less than a month old, so newborn. Um I have as the youngest, I have a sister who's 15 years under older than me, and then an older brother. Um, my sister's name is Maya, and then my brother, Ted, he is 23 years older than me.
SPEAKER_03So you didn't really experience being the youngest, you were kind of like the only child.
SPEAKER_00Exactly. That's a cool thing.
SPEAKER_03Well, and speaking about that, it's so tell me a little bit
Adoption And A Complicated Home
SPEAKER_03about your parents. What were they, what are what are they like?
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um, so my dad, let's just um my dad and mom are both five foot tall.
SPEAKER_02Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_00I'm about five, six. Um, and initially, you know, they didn't tell me that I was adopted. And it wasn't until I was about seven or eight years old that I was starting to realize, like, hey, you know, I have very curly big hair and you have poker straight hair. I'm a lot tanner than you, you know, all these little different nuances. Um, but I think, you know, looking back on it now, they they decided to not tell me that I was adopted because they thought it was going to be the best way to like make me feel included into the family. Um, my dad was very charismatic, uh, charming, um, very respectful, uh, and well respected within um where we worked in the compound. Um he was a chemical engineer or had his degree in chemical engineering. Um my mom, she for a long time, at least growing up, she was undiagnosed, uh paranoid schizophrenic. And so I would say a lot of the times upbringing was pretty tense. Um and I didn't understand why I didn't know what paranoid schizophrenic meant, or you know, what those symptoms were, but I always felt like um there was something always wrong. Something like you know, something was always out to get her, or like we did something on purpose that hurt her, or um yeah, so con consistently tense. Um both parents I'd say were really good cooks, uh, very good at cooking Filipino food, but um my dad was always gone, you know, working, providing, being the breadwinner. My mom, she didn't have schooling past eighth grade. So she's a SADO mom, didn't drive, um, very traditional, like um provide the man's a provider, the woman stays at home kind of thing. Um and you know, I yeah, I think growing up with those that mix, that very uh yin yang type of um parents, um, you know, I was very drawn to my father because I felt like he was safe and calm and just like always put together, versus my mom's always very hostile and uh uh accusatory or you know, just very mean.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Not that she was doing that on purpose, but that's just how it was, all right. And I'm sure that as we get into your story, that probably shaped how some of how you deal with things.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_03Um so you so you left Bahrain when you were 14? What was that like for you? I mean, I know that you'd said that you had come to the States and visited, but now you're leaving the safety of the compound, your friends, right. Everything you know, and you're headed to California.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so um growing up in that British curriculum, you know, after eighth grade, a lot of the students go to boarding school. They go back to England, they go back um to do their thing there. Uh so I think, you know, my parents had this grander vision that eventually I would move to the
California Culture Shock And Isolation
SPEAKER_00United States to go to school. And um, they stayed in Bahrain. So I was now going to school in Torrance, California at Bishop Montgomery High School, and it was a private school. Um, and I learned very quickly that uh if you're the new girl, you're not invited into the cliques, you're not cool. You know, kids already have a group of friends. Um so even though I've had seen the United States before, now being, you know, at this private school in like basically a mile from Redondo Beach, like a very fairly affluent uh area. Um, I felt really out of place. Really, really out of place. Um, and with my parents still being in Bahrain, um I stayed with my sister, who, you know, she ended up getting pregnant young, um, her senior year of high school. And so she was trying to be the breadwinner for her family. I think at the time she already had two kids, maybe three. Um, so she was never home either. Um, her her husband was a stay-at-home dad.
SPEAKER_03Okay. How how was that? How was that? Must have been a little bit different for you based on how your family was. Like, wait a minute, this is kind of backwards. How how how'd that impact you?
SPEAKER_00Um so let's see. Um growing up in Bahrain, it's very, like I said, communal or uh community oriented, very safe and friendly. Now, now I'm in California on my own. Um no supervision, pretty much, you know. Um my sister's always gone. She's trying to make you know money for the family. And um the her husband, um, not to get too dark too fast, but he was abusing me. And so I did everything in my power to not be at home, whether I was hanging out with my older cousins, going to clubs underage, going to raise, like anything to not play sports, you know, practices go to seven, eight, eight o'clock at in the evening, anything to to not be at home. But not having the power or courage to share that
Abuse And Learning To Dissociate
SPEAKER_00um those things were happening. I mean, they they had been happening. Every time we go to United States, you know, uh they would occur, but uh living with them was was much more frequent.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah. And uh that's gotta be making did that make you feel like powerless in a way? I mean, that's to me that's terrifying. Like your family's not there and that's going on, and you're kind of left to your own devices when you're not at home. Um I mean, clearly you survived that time, but um that that kind of trauma doesn't just go away.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, on one hand, I learned how to dissociate, which you know, at the time I thought I was just floating. You know, a lot of my memory was is not there, or like I don't have a very good, I can't recollect a lot of the things from my younger years except for the trauma.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_00And you know, your body adapts. It did what it needed to do or thought it needed to do to survive that period of my life. And honestly, it was the skill that I learned to then bring me through the military and to be able to operate at a high level with everything on fire and just chaos because that's how I grew up and I would keep my face still, like I was composed, but really just dissociated.
SPEAKER_03Right. Right. It's interesting you say that because um uh this is your interview, so I won't give too much into my childhood. But definitely um, but some of those things are familiar to me. Uh, and I remember when you say dissociated, I remember like um feeling like I was watching everything happen. Like I wasn't like I was watching these things. Yeah, yeah. Uh and it just hit me that that's exactly what was going on as we were talking. Um so you I mean you you make it you made it through school, then I'm assuming, and you uh you graduate. Were there things about school that you did enjoy? I mean, did you eventually make friends? Um, did you have favorite subjects? Did you play sports? Any of that kind of thing?
SPEAKER_00Sure. Um I I'm still friends with the the girls I met on the first day. Um one or two slightly closer than you know others, but still I you know, we still talk. Um so yeah, I was able to make friends um sooner rather than later. And we um we ended up getting into the rave scene, so the EDM culture of going to underground raves before it was really popular. Um and that was our little escape. Um when it came to school though, I really loved art. Um, I I was really
Sports, Friends, And The Rave Escape
SPEAKER_00good at art and um anything physical or fitness related, uh, I gravitated to sports, um tennis, basketball, softball. I played all those. Ended up being captain of all three by my senior year. And so yeah. I would say some of my um greatest strengths is encouraging the team. You know, I might not be the most skilled, definitely not the most skilled, but uh definitely to you know to the team. Um I I'm grateful to to recognize that now and not feel like um I'm still being humble about it.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. I mean the on any team, right? It's surrounding yourself with the people who can do the things you can't. Right. And know and knowing the things you can't do.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_03That you're not good at. Yeah, absolutely. Now, did you uh find that you were you able to share any of what was going on with your friends? That they were they aware of of your situation?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, um to it to a degree.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um, there was one time that it happened, I think towards the end of my sophomore year. Um and the excuse me, with the timeline might be a little blurry, but towards the end of my sophomore year, my parents moved from Bari. My dad retired, ended up moving back, moving to California. Um and uh eventually my sister like caught him in the act.
SPEAKER_02Right.
SPEAKER_00And instead of like doing anything about it, it was just shoved under the rug. And I did share that with my friends, but it was more of fuel to go full full into the rave scene, like really immerse myself in the drug culture, alcohol, like anything like you want to talk about dissociated to it, the 10th degree. Um yeah, uh, so we didn't really ask, not that we weren't not that we didn't care, but it was like, okay, well, she's managing however she's managing, and you know, everyone has their own trauma from home too. So let's support each other in this like ecosystem of fun and drugs and music.
SPEAKER_03Right. Well, a lot of the drugs from the rave scene are not like the typical drugs that people would take. Like I grew up in the 70s and the 80s, right? So it was a little bit different then.
SPEAKER_00But the the the rave drugs made you like feel and feel connected. Um yeah, very good for conversations, connected with strangers. Um, I felt really safe to lack of better words, but like like family, you know.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. And in in that scene, too, you were safe, right? Like the people that were there weren't going to. I mean, there's bad people everywhere, right? But by and large, the people that you are they weren't predatory or like weird.
SPEAKER_00It was very like peace loving like peace love and Bobby Sherman.
SPEAKER_03That's what we used to say.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03So you were kind of doing this through high school then.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Okay. And and so was the was the military like in the back of your mind somewhere during this time, or or I did not know what that was at all. Okay.
SPEAKER_00Um, yeah, to be honest. I I was still an immigrant, you know, I I did not have my citizenship. And so when I joined, um that was just a random phone call from a recruiter to my landline at home. And, you know, my dad hands the phone, like, hey, there's Sergeant Kim. I'm like, what is that? And uh he shares, like, hey, you know, what what do you have planned for college or after high school? Like, what are you doing gonna do? You know, I didn't what do you mean plans? I'm just trying to see to the next day or like make it, you know, to the next day. Like I hadn't applied to any big colleges or any of that kind of thing. Um, even though I did have the scores and the grades, my
Enlisting Without US Citizenship
SPEAKER_00parents weren't really concerned about that. So I I went to the recruiting station, you know, went down to see what he had to say about travel and school and all of that. And uh yeah, he said I could go to Germany and see what that's about. And it was and mentally it was a done deal in my mind.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, it sounded like a great way to kind of get out of that situation and figure things out.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, go ahead. Sorry.
SPEAKER_03Oh no, no, I'm I didn't mean to interrupt.
SPEAKER_00Oh no, please.
SPEAKER_03Oh so this is like in your senior year is when they were contacting you, and then uh you like took your ASVAB, which I'm pretty sure you did well on.
SPEAKER_00I did okay. Um, yeah, so it was just my close to the end of my senior year, which was 2002, uh, I took my ASVAP and I scored, I have a 116 GT, which I don't know what that means now. They change the testing and the scores all the time. But um basically it was like, oh, you can get pick any job you want. And I'm like, okay, great. Um and so when I went to MEPS um about maybe a month or so later, uh, they were like, Oh, yes, great test course, but you are not a citizen, so you can pick truck driver or cook. And cook. Yeah. So I signed up uh March 20th, 2003. Uh-huh. Um the day I went through MEPS, I was in the delayed entry program, so I didn't ship out for another like three months, I think.
SPEAKER_03So, how was that for you? This is uh this might seem like an odd question, right? But um once you're in the delayed entry program and you're getting ready to ship out, like there's some some things you can't do, like drugs um and get in trouble. Not that not that it sounds like you ever got in trouble, but that there was always that opportunity. Um, how did you like deal with that period of time where you're kind of waiting to go? Uh it's all set, but there's like this, I don't know, because I was in delayed entry for a while, and it's just like this dead time where you can't make plans. Yeah. So how was that for you?
SPEAKER_00Um, so I actually was enrolled at this community college called Orange Coast College there in California. I'd moved out of my parents' place, um, got shared a one-bedroom apartment, or like we rent I rented a room in somebody's house. Um, and it was me and my girlfriend at the time. So if you know anything about 2003, it was Don't Ask Don't Tell. Right. And, you know, my parents knew who she was. We were together for like two years. Um, anyway, so we got we got our own little room. Um, and I went to well, I was enrolled in community college. I only went to art class. I I because I knew I was gonna leave. So I was like, yeah, I don't really like math and English, whatever. I'm gonna go to art class instead. Um, but you know, transparently, I I didn't stop doing the drugs. I didn't I knew, you know, most of that stuff was only in your system for three days, so you could plan around that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah. I'm always curious because some people like they're like, oh my god, I gotta quit. And some people are like, ah, I got this. I served in the Navy for a a lot of years, and I remember guys, this is back in the 80s, who were still doing drugs while they were in the Navy, and they beat the system consistently. I know several of them are retired now, so um, yeah, I I I get it.
SPEAKER_00I mean, going to Germany for your first duty station, Amsterdam is not even three hours away. Let's just say, yeah, there was a lot of that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I can only imagine. So so talk to me about uh do so where did you go to basic training at?
SPEAKER_00Uh Fort Jackson, South Carolina, um, there for nine weeks, and then Fort Lee, Virginia for food special food service specialist, AIT, advanced individual training.
SPEAKER_03In other nine weeks. So when you got to basic training, um how well were you prepared for for how that was going to be? Um, you know, uh talk kind of walk me through like getting there and and what happens.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um,
Basic Training Validation And Leadership
SPEAKER_00so I don't know if this is what it's like in the Navy, but uh basic training is broken up into phases, right? So um I didn't do any prep or I didn't do any research, I didn't talk to um, or I didn't really not that I didn't care, but I just knew like I'm gonna show up and whatever's gonna happen is gonna happen. Hopefully I'm in good enough physical shape, or you know, they train us so I I can uh keep up. Um so those phases, right? Red, white, and blue, uh within red phase, by the second or third week, you guys are or we are um in platoons, right? And somebody is guiding this platoon now. You have a platoon guide and you're marching that person is marching them to and from chow and to the classroom and all of that. That was me. I I thrived with getting validated by my drill sergeant. I oh, you want me to stay, you know, at this position. Um During drill ceremony for a long time, don't talk. That's easy. Um, people, you know, you could see people fidgeting or whispering to each other left and right, just like you can call me a nerd or whatever, but I I knew like this was going to help me make me stand out more than my peers. And within a week or so, two, I'm like standing in the front of formation. Now I'm calling cadence and I'm marching everybody. And typically those platoon guides are, you know, they rotate them out, right? They give other soldiers a chance. I never got fired. I never got fired. And by the end of the cycle, you know, the the remaining platoon guides that are there, um, they go up against each other for this soldier of the month or soldier leader of the cycle competition. And I was the only female and I beat them all. So that kind of mindset, like, oh, okay, I I I can do this. Uh uh this is building my confidence. Um not that I actually like I could recite words or like I can I have good memorization skills. And the again, like the validation, this the stuff that I did not feel at home, I felt like I got from my drill sergeants or like that that environment. So I it really fueled me.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. And and I mean, those are those are great accomplishments, but I gotta ask, I don't want to put like too fine a point on it, but it sounds to me like during this period, like you weren't getting you weren't getting validation from yourself. Like it all had to be from somebody else. Like uh you don't know that you're good enough until someone else tells you that you're good enough.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and I didn't really I didn't know what that meant for I mean honestly within all just the last couple of years I finally realized what that means and how I love myself and really show up for myself. So I you know what is a boundary during those times. I I I didn't care about that. I just wanted to feel like somebody sees me, you know. Thank you. Um yeah.
SPEAKER_03Well, and the military's good at that. Like there's two ways to be seen in the military. One is you're doing a great job, and the other is you're not doing a great job, you know. There's all those under-the-radar people in the middle, yeah. Um, but they're they're no fun. Um, yeah. So you uh you you wow, you really excelled at basic training. I mean, that's a you know, from the outside looking in, that's a huge success story. And then you uh go on to AIT. And how was that for you?
SPEAKER_00That was very um, I mean, maybe not as I think because it was mixed. We also like did training with Marines. Yeah. And same kind of attitude, you know. I still wanted to show up, I still showed up um fully present and you know, tried my best. Um, but there was more freedoms in AIT, and I really leaned like, oh, not that we were going to rapes, but like we were off base doing a lot of wild things, uh and I was making friends. Like that was more of a priority than you know being in the front of the formation.
SPEAKER_03Right. Right. And then how so how long was AIT then? That was nine weeks. Nine weeks, okay. And then where do you go from there?
SPEAKER_00Then a quick trip back to home base, uh, Gardena. Um, I signed up uh where was I at? Somewhere in Orange County, California. I was there for a week, back at the recruiting station a week or two. And then first duty station is Mannheim, Germany, 28th Trans Battalion, uh, Mannheim, Germany. I loved it there. I thought I was gonna European out and stay in Germany. Um when I got there, it was uh definitely different from California. Um have you I don't know if you've spent any time in Europe, but really, really cool place.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, Europe's so old. Like and they and they embrace the oldness of Europe. Like I feel like in
Germany Freedom And Solo Travel
SPEAKER_03America we tear old stuff down and build new stuff.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03But uh Europe really embraces their oldness. I kind of like it.
SPEAKER_00The architecture, the history, which is great.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Yeah, and just the I mean Germany, just the music and the people, and the I mean, we could probably talk for hours on that, but uh so you get there and like was it was everything you thought it was gonna be?
SPEAKER_00I um, you know, growing up overseas, I I'm a little more open, I think, to different cultures, the diversity. Um on base, um uh in the chow hall, we actually worked with German cooks because we served German soldiers as well. Um so that part was kind of interesting. I I was not expecting that. Um, and then you know, going out into what it was the phrase? Um not out in the town. There was a phrase when you go off base and like just enjoy it'll it'll hit me like 30 minutes later. But um I really I really liked like making German friends and like really getting the full authentic, not I'm not a tourist experience, you know. Um within the first weekend, I'm hopping on a train. I'm going to Wiesbaden from Mannheim. I fell asleep on the train, I remember that, and panicking because I had passed my stop and it was like midnight. Yeah, not good. Um, but yeah, overall, I think just the culture and the experience, it was really awesome.
SPEAKER_03So do you think that your willingness to experience the culture made uh the people that you met, the the Germans that you met, treat you differently than the folks that were just there trying to get some good pictures and you know, a beer and abroad?
SPEAKER_00I I I really think so. Because like you really get um introduced to their culture, the food, the just the nuances. Um I love that you can hop on a train and like in a couple hours you're in a different country. Um, I got a lot of my tattoos in Belgium, um, which is like unheard of, but like um, yeah, it I think I really appreciate the fact that I did not wait to like some people are like, I can't eat dinner on my own at a restaurant, or I can't travel by myself. And oh man, if I waited to for that, I I wouldn't have seen half the stuff that I've you know seen or experienced half the stuff. And so just having that, you know, courage or tenacity to just hop on a train and figure it out on the go, it's it's really been beneficial for me.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03There's something something, I don't know, comforting sometimes about that aloneness. Like I don't mind going to a restaurant and saying, oh, table for one.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_03They look at you like it's sad and pathetic, but it really isn't. Like it this is nice.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's nice, it's quiet. There's freedom to go and come and go as you please. Um, I've had amazing conversations with people that are like sitting next to me at the bar or at a restaurant. Um yeah, there's some cool stories just from you know being able to travel on my own, having the confidence to travel.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, and to be able to talk to like even though you're alone, you can talk to people.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Now, how long were you in Germany?
SPEAKER_00Uh almost four years, about four years.
SPEAKER_03All right. When you look back on that experience, like what's like the thing that pops into your mind for like the very first like memory or the thing that you really remember as being terrific or whatever. Just whatever like sticks in your mind about Germany.
SPEAKER_00Um so I didn't stop raving. I I liked going to dance clubs. I would go to dance clubs on my own, and I I love dancing. That was my not that I did not do drugs, but that was kind of my outlet there. Um to have the freedom to to pick up and go to a music festival or go to a dance club, um, and just you know, dance my troubles away.
SPEAKER_03Now you're more of a uh like a techno-dance type person. Okay. All right. I was just curious because there's some really crazy I I listen to a lot of uh like German rap music.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah, you do.
SPEAKER_03When I work out, yeah. So I'm like, oh, this is great. Like I don't know, I don't understand half of what they're saying.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Oh, that's amazing. Um, I'm not even I'm not that familiar with German rap, but um definitely hip hop and stuff like that.
SPEAKER_03So you just kind of parted your way through through uh through Germany. How how is that like so how how are the are the raves different from here in the States or are they not different?
SPEAKER_00I would say they're grander, they're bigger. Um, I mean, um somebody might argue with the my historical you know knowledge of EDM music, but I I think it originated from Europe. Um and I remember going to like Berlin or Munich, downtown, like um and seeing DJ Tieso like in the middle of this huge like 300-year-old sculpture, you know, that's been there forever, and just like the the speakers on each side, and like tens of thousands of people like in the in the city cityscape or whatever, you know, I can't remember the phrase now, but yeah, downtown. It's just yeah, it's freaking awesome.
SPEAKER_03It sounds like it definitely sounds like it. Now, the other thing you said you got your tattoos in in Belgium. Yeah, that just isn't yeah. Like that's not anything I've ever heard of. Um, you don't think of Belgium as like the tattoo capital of the world or anything, right?
SPEAKER_00No, no, no. Um, no, I um I'm so glad I found him too. Daniel Dimasha, calypso tattoo. Um, so I eventually started wanting to get I had one tattoo and I wanted to get more. And I wanted to get them uh to kind of honor my parents, you know, my family, like bringing me in. Uh and after some search on Google, I discovered that Filipinos also have their own tribal markings. I didn't know that was a thing. I thought it was just like Hawaiian or Samoan. Um, but a lot of the Pacific Islands are the islands that are in the Pacific Ocean, um, have their own unique like layout,
Tattoos And Filipino Heritage Reclaimed
SPEAKER_00uh patterns, motifs, meanings. And I found this uh website called Tatakna Patna Alon, which means Mark of the Four Waves. And the founder, L. Feston, he he's been studying tattoo markings, he'll be know tattoo markings and other cultures for the last 15, 20 years at that point. And um, you know, I I read over it and I was like, well, I don't really know, like my parents didn't teach me any of this stuff. Um, but there was a questionnaire form that if I take this to my parents and be like, hey, like, can we talk about this and let me know where our ancestors are from and what we used to do and all of that good stuff? I sent him the answers and then I told him I wanted two quarter sleeves, so just the outside, the shoulder cap, and then to the elbow at the time on both sides. Um, he's like, Yeah, uh I will design the sleeve for you, quarter sleeve for you. And then you gotta find someone to do it, right? And so that's when I found a black work artist, is was his specialty. So a lot of like mandalas and um solid lines, and uh yeah, that's that's where I got the majority, the majority of this side. Um, and I left Germany by the time I got this side, but yeah.
SPEAKER_03Well, and so that's like my my kids um all have tattoos, and the one thing that I've told them is do not get drunk and pick something off the wall, like right. So all their tattoos have meanings. Yeah, and clearly your tattoos have a really deep, deep meaning for you.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Well, you didn't pick those off the wall.
SPEAKER_00No, there's no number seven, you know. I didn't I didn't say that. Um that's that's really good advice. I just um, you know, I've seen those I don't know if they call them passports, but like you'll just get random stuff all over and just kind of do a collage of randomness. I mean to each their own, but my yeah, mine definitely mean something very special to me.
SPEAKER_03Well, and the challenge with a tattoo, you said it like you get one and then you're like, oh well, I need another one, and I need to do that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, another one and done or one and you never stop.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, like I've got one and I'd really like to get more. Um, there's some discussion that has to happen before that goes on, but yeah, yeah. Um yeah, I mean, because they they do like, I don't know, I feel like it it you can like paint your life on your body.
SPEAKER_00No, absolutely. Um, so I continued on, you know, I got my sleeves done, but I have my entire back done, uh chest, uh what's the sternum, and then I started my leg. Um in traditional Filipino culture, you have the bodysuit, right? And women get until above the knee on the outside. So that's yeah.
SPEAKER_03So so uh it's not uncommon for Filipino women then to have tattoos.
SPEAKER_00So after the Spanish colonization, you know, they conquered the Philippines for over 300 years. Um, these tattoos are typically like, oh, you're a savage, you're uncivilized, um, you're out in the jungle, like out in the rice fields, whatever. Um so they weren't, and that's why I even I a lot of Filipinos don't know that Filipinos have them because they're I don't say shunned, but they're not well known.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um, and so uh when I found Elle, his whole mission was to kind of revive the knowledge and uh awareness of Filipino tattoos and Filipino tattoo culture. So it's not a very common thing, no.
SPEAKER_03Oh, okay. All right, yeah, because so my daughter has uh tattoos, she's like almost sleeved out on both sides. She's a school teacher, and um, she was going to uh uh interview for a job, and she said, uh I think I should wear like something to cover up my tattoos, and I said, No, here's the deal: go in there with your tattoo show and wear what you're comfortable wearing. If they don't want you because of that, that is not where you belong. A hundred percent because they're gonna see them at some point, right? And you're proud of them. If they don't like it, you don't belong there.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I love that advice. I love that advice, and she's super happy.
SPEAKER_03She got the job and she's doing really well, anyway. So you uh you leave Germany. What so what year would this have been?
SPEAKER_00Um, I left Germany in 2007.
SPEAKER_032007, okay, and and what happens next?
SPEAKER_00So I actually get out of the army. Um, I was married at the time, and my husband was stationed in Hawaii, and I go to be with him as a dependent now. And um I was not being a faithful wife, and that gets revealed. Um, and instead of
Leaving Army Then Reenlisting In Chaos
SPEAKER_00Joe, I mean, Joe is such a kind, very, very kind man. Um, very calm in the whole, you know, for the most part, uh breakup phase of this marriage. Um, but I was now living back with my parents in California, um, trying to figure out what I wanted to do or how what the next steps were. Yeah, so um, uh as you can imagine, or maybe, you know, I did not want to be a cook. So the skills that I had learned as a cook in the military is not something I wanted to continue moving forward. Um I ended up trying to go to hair school, Paul Mitchell Hair School, and I asked them if they took the GI bill, and for whatever reason, they did not. And I, yep, exactly. Uh-huh. I was like, hey, this tuition can be fully paid for. Like, oh no, we don't do that. I'm like, oh, okay. Um, and maybe it was just the wrong person asked, or like a new intern. I don't know. But that I didn't exactly pursue it after that. I was like, okay, well, I need to make money now. Like, I um my parents had been supporting my sister and her four kids um forever. Like, you know, the house, the cars, like they always were there for for her financially. But I I worked in high school. I bought my own first car. I when I moved back in, even in this situation, I'm now paying rent and paying for groceries, you know, like and I'm I'm the baby, like I'm the youngest. Um so I I didn't have time to uh figure it out really. I'm just like, well, you know, whether that's an excuse or not, I ended up auditioning to dance and I was hired right away. Um, not that I don't think they turn anyone away. But um yeah, I fell in love with the fast life. Um again, back to drugs, back to you know, high-risk behavior. Um and there was nobody telling me no. And there was nobody in my house saying, like, hey, are you okay? Hey, like, you know, want to talk about it? You know, not none of that. They just saw that I bought a you know, used but new car, like this sports two-doors, two-seater sports car, and I look like I'm living this like lavish life or whatever. Yes, I come back home, but um I look like I had my shit together, which I did not. Um but I somehow woke up fairly soon, maybe within five or six months of that doing that life. I'm like, I don't know what I want to do, but it's not this. It's not how I want I see myself long term, like yeah. Um, and so I couldn't, I didn't know how to hold myself up or hold, you know, keep myself accountable, but I knew something that did know how to keep me accountable, and I joined the army again.
SPEAKER_03Okay, and they welcomed you back, right?
SPEAKER_00They sure did with open arms.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I'll bet. I'll bet. So this is like what 2010?
unknownNo.
SPEAKER_032008. Oh, so it's very, very soon then like everything kind of okay.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_03So you you joined again, you didn't have to go back to basic.
SPEAKER_00No, basic, just um um for like NCO, because I was at E5 at the time, so NCOs that are like retraining or reclassify classifying. Um I went straight to AIT. And because now I was a citizen and I had the test course, I was offered signals intelligence analyst um at NSA Hawaii, because technically I was still married. I hadn't finished getting divorced yet, so I'm gonna go be with my husband, right? So he's in Hawaii. Um, so that's where I got orders to go um after AIT.
SPEAKER_03Now, did you did you see him when you were there?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. He picked me up. He was the one to pick me up. Like he, I'm telling you, like he's so kind and just very understanding. And I mean, uh for years after we divorced, we were still friends, and um, we were actually in Afghanistan at the same time, not at the same place, but checking in on each other.
SPEAKER_03It's good to have a friend like that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, he's very, very sweet.
Hawaii Intel, Motherhood, And Restlessness
SPEAKER_03So you uh you got to Hawaii and um how was that?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, um so in AIT, um I guess I I don't know how to operate unless everything's at 100 miles an hour. Um, and so I was doing well on AIT, you know, some of the top like at least physical scores, test scores, people were blowing me out of the water because uh that's six months in uh Goodfill Air Force Base. Um it's a hard school. Uh and I ended up getting pregnant. I ended up getting pregnant with my first child. Um, so I show up to my unit in Hawaii pregnant. Um obviously it's not Joe's, but on paper I'm married. Um and by the grace of UCMJ, I did not get any reprimand or nobody brought it up. Um and so we ended up, you know, he's in his own quarters, I'm in my own barracks, whatever. We're we're officially separating at this point. So they the people us in or in processing me get understand the the deal like we're not together together which is on paper. And yeah, I mean as soon as I got there, I mean I had the tribal tattoos. I kind of look, you know, people were speaking to me and how like or pigeon. Um and I assimilate is not a good word, but like just like I was in Germany, I I fit right in. Like I people thought I was Turkish, you know, I I almost um preferred that because like it was I don't feel like an outsider. I feel like welcomed. And so same with Hawaii, if not even even more so. And I ended up having Jasmine um April of 2009. And yeah I raised her by myself more or less because her father was stationed in Korea for the first year, year and a half and we didn't work out um for a bunch of reasons. But um he ended up after Korea getting stationed in Hawaii so we were co-parenting. Still very amicable whatever. And yeah um I quickly learned that I did not like to be in the skiff. I did not like to be underground in the tunnels doing military intelligence work. It was very I mean it looks cool on in the movies and I'm sure there are really really cool missions at NSA Hawaii but I was with the counterterrorism cell and it was very slow um and I don't like slow. I'm not used to slow. So I did everything I could to be out of the SCIF whether I'm the training NCO I'm now the platoon sergeant I'm out of the SCIF officially my additional duties are to train our unit twice a day. You know I'm I'm doing the PT in the morning leading the PT in the morning and then for those that are struggling a little bit with their weight or uh PT scores in the evening or afternoon I'm leading the PT there. And so that's really great if you you know unexpectedly see a poster in the middle of the SCIF or in the hallway that talk about this a very mysterious program. And you know having the time to train that much was very beneficial to me when I saw that poster um to go through selection for the Cultural Support Team program.
SPEAKER_03Okay. I want to ask a quick question. Do you find that like throughout your life when things were quiet like you needed the chaos to function like even though chaos is totally crazy like I need I like I can't function unless it's chaotic.
SPEAKER_00So you would create your own chaos that's the preferred that isn't the norm right yeah it's the the standard from growing up in that crazy house is crazy. Like I don't know anything else. And as soon as it gets more calm or peaceful or sometimes I would label boring um my subconscious is like oh I don't know this I I don't like it here. I need to do something to go back to the madness the self-sabotaging behavior the high risk behavior like that's what I know.
SPEAKER_03Yeah because it feels weird to be what everyone else would call normal. I would I would argue though that everyone's normal is normal like that's just your normal that's how it is it's what you do with it that matters right so you get accepted into this program like are you so are you like one of the first women that are that are brought into this program? So you're kind of a pioneer in that respect.
SPEAKER_00I would say I'm part of the first women to ever go through the selection process to apply get accepted go through the selection process at uh SFAS or special forces assessment and selection for this program which if you're unfamiliar if you're listening it's um the military decided to assign women to special operations units tier one tier two units to go outside of the wire with them to manage the women and kids out on target or in the compounds in the villages um and it initially was you know I'll say sold to us but like presented as like you know hearts and minds or like uh shake you know
Cultural Support Team Selection Pressure
SPEAKER_00shaking hands kissing babies um and uh I mean even if you were doing the the day operations or the relationship management um I selected or was chosen to do the night operations or night rates and there was not much kissing babies and shaking hands.
SPEAKER_03Yeah more like shaking babies and kissing hands I laugh but that is true.
SPEAKER_00So what is what is uh what was selection like for you um I mean they weren't used to having women in this right no uh we only had one uh trainer that was a female Psyop sergeant um all the rest were like rangers or SF guys or SF dudes and um you know especially being with the first cohort to go through selection like this I think they they were also still trying to figure it out like how do we assess women to determine if they're not just physically capable but like mentally resilient to to hang and do these things that we're gonna ask of them. And so the beginning stages the first few days were more the physical challenges that were tested and timed the nine nine mile ruck march uh PT tests um height weight you know the regular stuff um and then as the days went on it was more randomized testing um and how so how long were you uh in selection? So selection the first week of it they did it in multi phases um the first week is five or six days um and that's a lot of the more physical stuff uh psyche valves um randomized testing um I would I say like at the first on first on the first day excuse me day zero um there might have been 170 maybe 200 of us um and then by day five day six graduation um there were 35 40 that made it um and that would then split to day ops and night ops um and you know I'm not really sure the exact reason why but four of us of the 35 were asked to return back for this following cycle to not go straight into phase two of the training and so um the girls that made it through the initial cohort went straight into pre-deployment training to then get ready to go to Afghanistan. What me and three other um graduates they were asked to come back to like when they're starting to get back come back we're now gonna high five them and you know our our turn um which I initially was like oh why didn't I make it you know why am I not going through um but uh looking back on it now it's like okay well they had a whole year ish nine months to figure out some learnings you know like what do we really need to implement what what kind of training do they really need and not saying they figured it all out by cohort too but um yeah I was I was grateful to be held back yeah yeah it's always nice to get lessons from people who lived it right yeah and so um during this time so where was selection at then um it's at Fort Bragg so the same where special forces go to go get their tab same uh grounds okay we even did uh field exercise with the guys that were going through um to yeah whatever phase of their training it was uh I'm sure there's their selection is a lot longer than ours but um yeah it was a mixed uh some of us were you know carrying the 50 cals like or uh uh m240 or whatever it's called um trying to figure out you know lane fire lanes and doing tactics and and all of that with with the guys um everyone was so sleep deprived I I could barely remember by then um uh just madness chaos right right which was where you belonged yeah right at home yeah now how long were you at Bragg then total like oh yeah with the pre-deployment training yeah you got like six weeks of that and then maybe like a week we came back again um maybe like a week right before like that's when we get our gear and you know um all the paperwork ready or cleared to leave leave to go in country.
SPEAKER_03Okay.
SPEAKER_00Now is Jasmine staying with your parents this time or is she with her dad or how's that she's with her dad yeah we um you know even though through the breakup we 50-50 custody um all of that good stuff which you know transparently like I'm just very grateful that I um you he stepped up he was a very good you know dad to take responsibility so after we broke up broke up he was the primary uh parent and um it took me like I said uh those whole that whole boundary thing what I you know learning about myself and how to love myself that was a long tumultuous journey that um I recently finally can say I'm very comfortable with who I am now and you know what that means and now my daughter lives with me okay all right yeah it's it's uh for some people it's a lifelong journey right yeah yeah yeah and are we ever really there I don't know I'm not a psychiatrist but uh yeah I'm just a guy that interviews people yeah yeah so you uh you do all your train up I'm just curious so Fort Bragg there used to be a place called the mug right outside of base I don't know if that's still there or not but uh well when I was going like it was pretty not say strict but I wasn't going for once I was not going out and partying there were no raves in Fort Bragg right no not that I knew of I probably would have heard but um yeah it was pretty pretty focused then um and even like Raleigh's about an hour away but I yeah I wasn't familiar with the uh the mug yeah probably still there yeah I I have a I have a younger brother who was a musician and when I lived in Virginia we drove to Fort Bragg to see him play at this bar oh cool different story for a different time but uh yeah so you get all your train up done and then you head to Afghanistan?
SPEAKER_03Is that all right talk talk to me about that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah um so towards the end of uh training the you know the candidates get to make a wish list of who they want to be assigned to and even without doing much research everyone knows of SEAL team six so I I put that as like top like I I really would like to be assigned to them. They get the best missions most prestige most toys you know all of that. And I had a top secret clearance because I was an Intel and so I think that plus uh my physical capability and I was a very much a quiet professional um that I got what I asked what was on my wish list. And so I'm in Afghanistan February 2012 Fobshank um Logar province with Red Squadron of SEAL Team 6.
SPEAKER_03Wow not many people I have interviewed I've interviewed 170 people not many of them say they got what was on their wish list but I mean is that a wish list for many people too I I'm not sure.
SPEAKER_00Yeah yeah you may just be picking right so what was that deployment like for you um you know like we've talked about here like operating under craziness is normal and so I can I go I get
Afghanistan With SEAL Team 6
SPEAKER_00there I get to the SCIF and I'm it's very high viz role at the moment like this is a very new program like can the girls really do this like did we make a mistake like make sure all eyes on them at all times you know all of that stuff um and so keeping my face composed even though inside I'm like what the fuck am I doing what am I doing here? Why did I sign up for this? But also like it's kind of cool like I get to do cool shit but also I don't know what I'm doing and these men have been training they are freaking flawless like clearing rooms you know like and you expect me I have five minutes of training compared to them and now I'm under a microscope of like don't fuck this up a lot that's going on um at the same time so it's hard to really you know what are my biggest takeaways like I'm I'm very proud proud of my time there um an adopted orphan girl immigrant girl from Bahrain is now on the front lines with literally red squadron some of the same guys were who are on the bin Laden raid like which I didn't know until later but um like what the fuck you know it's very you can't really make that up um uh yeah but you know everything's not rainbows and butterflies there's some shady shit that we did and moral injury and all of that stuff um so it's hard for me to you know overall I I'm very proud of my time over Splash I think we can all say we did things that maybe we didn't agree with but stuff had to get done. So is now you you earned your bronze star on that deployment then okay that's not nothing it um you know I don't keep up with that but somebody one of the uh not team guys but when I came back um I was talking to one of my vet friends and he was like how many women have a bronze star I'm like I don't know I've never googled it he's like let me google this right now and it wasn't very many yeah yeah yeah yeah and it was earned there are some bronze stars that weren't earned we can all say that but that that seems like it was earned to me and are you still kind of in this part of your life where you're you're like wanting that outside like validation still it took me even after getting out of the army and you know after active duty it took me a long time I I was for a while it was just you know uh same motives different uniform yeah and so did you deploy again after after Afghanistan or did you no I decided to get out um it was in Afghanistan then I returned back to art I started painting and drawing uh in my tent uh and I was like oh I think I'm done with the army you know I don't know what what will would top this you know this is a highlight of my career kind of thing and um uh yeah I'm going to go to art school and so within six months of coming back from Afghanistan I'm in an art class at Ultimate University um trying to fulfill what I thought or think is my purpose and passion and I went full in you know uh blinders on like only art is what I'm going to do um and so as you can imagine art school
Art School, Addiction, And Cracking Masks
SPEAKER_00is not as intense as uh being in Afghanistan and so I supplemented my need for adrenaline or chaos or my nervous system being at a hundred with drugs and alcohol again. Did that cause you problems uh yeah I was married at the time again and I you know I didn't tend to my marriage I really had I don't know all my energy into um doing my art my coursework and being in my studio 247 um and you know eventually things started to crack uh the mask wasn't working um he started cheating on me you know and I didn't I didn't know that but also like who wouldn't you know like I don't there's a woman upstairs somewhere doing something I I barely see her um you know uh we were going to marriage counseling and even the therapist who specifically deals with or treats Navy SEALs because he was Navy SEAL um was like you are the man in this relationship do you know that and I was like oh it's like yeah you don't know how to process your emotions or feelings and um and I didn't uh this one of the biggest things I took away from my mom I think we mentioned very early in the interview um she it was her way of the highway always you didn't want to talk about what was bothering her you couldn't bring it up she would leave the room come back and don't like everything's fine we act like everything's normal um and I you know copy paste I I would do the exact same thing um like very low emotional intelligence I didn't know how to process anything I had never been a therapy prior to this marriage counseling I didn't dealt with any of the uh sexual abuse from a kid nothing from Afghanistan like it was just checking on and on and on and on eventually we broke up um I I got accepted on paper I was still like excelling I got accepted I got my degree I got accepted into this year-long residency program for advertising for special operations veterans um I'm in now Boston New York like at these advertising agencies just like whatever it looked it looked nice um but my marriage was failing and I had a newborn son um and I didn't know who I was or how to process and I went you know back to the drugs and alcohol right right and so what year what year is this about when when your son was born uh he's born in 2015 okay 2015 so your your daughter would be what she's 17 now yeah and so your son's like 11 yeah good ages good math good ages yeah yeah yeah I'm not smart but I do know math once in a while so yeah 2015 just kind of rolling around it and again like I think for so many veterans everything does look good on paper but inside you're just like right you're like no one sees it either like you're the c I used to work for someone and um we worked in uh emergency response and one day she this all hell was breaking loose and she pulled me into the office and she said I need you to like respond and I'm like I'm doing it all up here I said I'm not gonna run around with my hair on fire if that's what you're looking for I'm not doing that but I'll get this fixed for you don't worry but inside you're just like everything's going but outside you're just you know cool as a cucumber I guess to use an old phrase so I think that it's that way for some veterans or for a lot of people who have been through some things that's how you deal with it right I um the the phrasing that you use I remember my uh my son's father uh he I finally like did an outburst or said something he's like oh finally a reaction like something you know um I always I don't know thought keeping it cool and just was how I was supposed to manage you know deal with it suppress suppress suppress numb disconnect right that that was how I knew how to do deal with it and um eventually it just exploded like I finally decided to ask for help and shared you know more publicly you know outside of my friend circle like Hey, I've been abused, you know, um, I don't know what to do. I've never talked to anyone about this on a you know professional scale or setting. And and then um eventually a veteran reached out and she was like, Hey, um, we weren't very close, but we were part of one of the the Pat Sillman Foundation, um with Pat Sillman scholars, and she met connected me with one of her friends, and he brought me to my first uh psychedelic therapy or psychedelic experience. And that's when I started doing psychedelic medicine for for healing.
SPEAKER_03Uh-huh. And how how is that working for you? Is that um?
SPEAKER_00That is um, you know, before going to my first bayote
Psychedelic Healing And Ibogaine Sobriety
SPEAKER_00ceremony, bayote ceremony in 20 April 2020, I um I had tried the traditional talk therapy, VA, all the meds, you know no man. Um, and I wasn't getting anywhere. You know, I could go to my weekly appointment and just say whatever's on the surface, not really feel any of it. And if anything, most of the time it triggered me to go to the bar after. Like I I wasn't coping. Um I wasn't taught any of the integration tools or and so for me, the uh psychedelic therapy. Um I showed up almost with I would say blind faith. I didn't do much research again. Um, maybe if the mindset like I have nothing to lose, like here, what you know, I've done every other drug.
SPEAKER_03But how how bad could this be?
SPEAKER_00How bad could it be? Um in the middle of a desert with a roadman and strangers and just pouring out every deep trauma that I know. Um, but I I it changed my life. I I don't know exactly what changed that in that moment, but I knew something changed. I felt a lot lighter, um, more connected to myself. So I knew I had to keep coming back. And so I committed. I mean, I the time I was living in Dallas and I'd fly to California, you know, every three or four months to go to a ceremony. Um, but when I come back, you know, a lot of my friends were drug addicts or not, you know, part of that kind of lifestyle. Um, and so I, you know, I'd be clean for a little bit and then relapse and I'd go back into it. Um, but every time I'd go back to ceremony and come back, you know, I felt like I healed a little bit more, got a little bit further along. And then I found, you know, psychedelic therapy specifically for veterans. And so that was in a more not to say clinic, clinical setting, but it was supervised by a doctor, Dr. Martin Polanko. And your uh journeying with other special operations veterans or veterans in general. Um, and this time it's psilocybin or mush mentioned mushrooms and five. And yeah, uh same thing, you know, I'd do it, I'd go travel to work Mexico or Austin or wherever, and um, I'd be good for a little bit, but I wasn't making the long-term changes I needed after ceremony integration. Um, and I would relapse. Um, and eventually I ended up in a relationship that's really toxic. We enabled each other, our drug habits uh just exasperated um and over overshadowed any kind of responsibility, like, oh, I quit my job, I don't want to do this advertising thing anymore, I'll try this social media thing, like and not taking it seriously because it the lifestyle was more important than the output. Yeah. Um and yeah, uh eventually got into opiates, and so I was doing cocaine and percocets every day. Um and you know, no job, uh now going through a breakup, uh crashing on my friend's place until I figured my life out. Um and calling back to Dr. Martin Polanco and you know, like, hey, like I I think I'm ready for Ibogaine, which is one of the strongest, if not the strongest psychedelic out there. Um and it's known or being researched for opiate addiction, alcoholism, and stuff like that. And uh that's a Tuesday morning, and he goes, Can you be in Mexico by Friday? And I, you know, I didn't have the funds or means, and so I said I was like, okay, well, shit. Um, let me try and make some four more phone calls and see what I can do. Um, and I was able to get funding from Sabo Foundation to send me to Mexico to get the the Ibegan treatment. And I haven't touched No Pete since that's when I really decided to get my shit together, and I moved to Baltimore for a new job that I got. And yeah, it's been just up and up some ebbs and flows, but you know, for the most part, just an incredible journey since that treatment.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. So how long have you been sober? How long ago was that treatment?
SPEAKER_00July 2023.
SPEAKER_03Okay. So it worked.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Now, do you do you do microdosing or anything like that?
SPEAKER_00I have, yeah. Um, since then I've microdosed um shrooms. I initially microdosed shrooms in the beginning to get off of SSRIs. Um and that worked really well for me. And then last year I started kind of getting cravings a little bit. Um, and so I microdosed ibogaine.
SPEAKER_03That seemed uh well, you know, I I think I think everyone has a path. And um, I know I know personally veterans who are very close to me who um drink a lot of alcohol, and they um tried the whole VA, here's your here's your bag of MMs, go home and um you know, don't jump off a building until you come back. And none of it worked. Um, but they they use cannabis and chemistry. Oh, they fixed it. Like there's not a one-size-fits-all, right? SSRIs aren't the fix-all for and I'm not a doctor, so I'm not giving advice here, but there are different steps that different people can take to get the result that they're looking for. And any of it, you gotta want it, right? You can't. I mean, you could do all the treatments you're doing, but if you don't want to stop drinking alcohol, you're you're just not like this is just another thing I'm gonna do. Um, but it sounds like you had some reasons why you wanted to stop going down that path.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I um, you know, you nailed it right on the head, like you could people your family could beg you to go, um, but if you don't want to stop, you're not going to. Um yeah, I think I was just I was tired of letting myself down, you know. Um uh I used to be super disciplined and I I I know how to take care of my body and you know, all of these things. Just um the reasons why I was doing that to go into the army, to go through selections. It never really at its core was for me. It was for me to prove myself to somebody to accept me. Um and it took me going through this like emotional intelligence four-month, four and a half month program for me to really understand, at least dig past the surface of what that means, who I am, um how I need to be loved and show up for myself. Um, and I think the combination of the the treatment, the psychedelic treatment, and the that program is really why I've been able to maintain my sobriety.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. And your kids your kids are with you now?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, well, my daughter is with me. Um my ex-husband were not on good speaking terms. Um he and his new wife, which is who he was cheating on me with, um, yeah. Uh they don't really see a need for me in the picture.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And uh have even though on paper it says like we have uh I have visitation and monthly arrangements and all the good stuff, and it was happening for a long time. Um it stopped happening May 28th, 29th, 2022.
Custody Loss And Rebuilding Life
SPEAKER_00Um, when I shared with my son that uh I was married to Robert, to his dad, and um it didn't fit the narrative like uh yeah, this like controlled narrative of who I am in this picture. Um and so yeah, that was the last time I've seen him. Um when I moved to they've been in Maryland the whole time. I was in Dallas traveling to see him, you know, as much as I could. Uh when I moved to Baltimore, I'm like, hey, Marilyn, it's you know, I'm literally 45 minutes from you. Can we like, you know, try this again? Can we be not even a year later, you know? And um Robert was like, yeah, yeah, we're ready now. I think it's time for you to come back and we've hash this out and all this good stuff and smoke and mirrors. Every time I, you know, bring it up for real. Okay, like what time do you want me to drop by or make a phone call? He wouldn't answer for months or weeks. And after speaking to some lawyers, finally I'm like, okay, like I've been naive enough to believe the bullshit for long enough. Um, you know, I need some legal, real legal advice. You know, I've been advised not to stop by there. It could be traumatic for Sterling. You know, also not look um not be in my favor, like if, you know, uh in front of the judge, you know, irrational, uh whatever, with my emotions. Um, and so I was exploring talking to a lawyer uh within the last year, and then you know, Jasmine moving in with me um was an unexpected, but great, you know, I'm grateful for this blessing, but I wasn't expecting it. And so, you know, I'm trying to get her settled in and let priority for now um and financially figure out where we're at um before I can explore uh getting a lawyer again.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Yeah, not that I mean that's we've all had things happen, but that's pretty rough right there. That's but you seem to be calm about it. Are you calm about it though? Really?
SPEAKER_00Uh you know, the longer I talk about it or like think about it, the more frustrating it is because I cannot make sense of it. Like there no angle or what ifs could make me understand why like pushing me out completely like this makes any sense.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um you know, I'm adopted, or Sterling's father's adopted, that my ex-husband, like, so why wouldn't you why would you not want him to know his birth parents? Um, and yeah, I was going through some you know crap and I figured it out. Um so I'm just but nothing that I would claim like I've never put him in danger or like I would never risk um not showing up for him and so it's um yeah, it's frustrating, but everything happens for a reason.
SPEAKER_03True. So what do you um so what are you doing now? Like where where are we at now? Are you um are you working in the art field? You know, what's what's going on with you now?
SPEAKER_00Where am I at? Um yes, I'm an artist, creator, storyteller, writer, um, advocate for psychedelic therapy, veterans. Um, so a lot of my work is um like at the art studio. I do paintings, I have a couple art shows coming up. Um I'm writing, I'm um in the process of writing my memoir, which it's written. I have an agent. Uh it's being submitted to publishing houses. Hopefully, an editor sees this
Art, Advocacy, And Service Today
SPEAKER_00and I can like, you know, we can do the thing.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, it can be published.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it can be published. Um and advocating for psychedelic therapy, you know. Uh-huh. Did some time um with the mission within Capitol Hill, sharing my story. Um, I think it's been my biggest form of service so far. Um, being very vulnerable and candid about these things that we're talking about today has been um a healing for me, but also healing for others.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Yeah, that's one of the reasons we do what we do, right? Because people listen to these stories. Like it's for me, it's always great to tell my story because I feel like a little bit less burdened every time I tell my story. Um, but every time I tell my story, someone comes up and says, Hey, I thought I was the only person that went through that. And I'm sure that you've experienced that. And that to me, that's that's the kind of external recognition that makes sense. Like I helped you and you're telling me that I helped you. That's that's different than just being recognized for other things.
SPEAKER_00It takes a lot of courage for someone to do that, you know? They're being very vulnerable with a stranger.
SPEAKER_03Right. No, absolutely. Yeah. And 170 people so far have done that, and I appreciate every single one of them. Every every story has been incredible. Um, and so the work that you're doing um right now, um, and I know we keep talking about recognition, but you've also been recognized by the DAV. Um, is that part is that part of what you're what you're working with the psychedelics uh therapy and that sort of thing?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so DAV and I connected sometime early last year. And, you know, as one of the oldest nonprofits for veterans around, um, the fact that they wanted to talk to me about my ibogaine journey, I was one of the first or the first person they ever interviewed to share um my experience with them. And it kind of snowballed into something within their organization where members, you know, within their leadership, with it, you know, they're going through their own healing journey with psychedelics. And now they're advocating for it, and now they're putting budget behind it and um just the ripple effect of how it's paying forward, um, you know, not only internally within this great organization, but what who they're going to touch or educate or um advocate for um within this realm. I just it's very exciting to see someone of that, you know, an organization of that stature um believe in it.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I can I can believe it. So we've talked about a lot over the last, has it been a couple hours almost?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Almost a couple hours. Is there anything that we haven't touched on that you did want to talk about?
SPEAKER_00Um, I mean, well, I think we covered a lot of the you know biggest milestones um in my uh you know life experience so far. So I think I feel pretty good about what we hear.
SPEAKER_03All right. Well, I'll ask you one final question then, and that is um uh, you know, if someone's listening to this story a hundred years from now when neither one of us are here, what would you like them to take away from it?
SPEAKER_00The strength is in the return. Finding yourself, finding your way back to yourself is one of the biggest gifts you can give, not only for yourself, but to your family and to your community.
Strength Is In The Return
SPEAKER_00Uming who you are, what it means to love yourself, how to sh how you want to show up is um no one can take that away from you. And showing up that authentically is a gift that um pays it forward tenfold, a hundredfold.
SPEAKER_03All right. Well, thanks again for sharing that with us. Thanks for sitting here and talking with me, answering all my questions. I really appreciate it.
SPEAKER_00Thank you, Bill. I appreciate it.
